9.14 Ep reaction/review

[ash48]

I may need to sit on this episode for a while. Mull it over a bit (as ya do). I think there was some interesting stuff in there, it's just that I came off it feeling much like the boys did. Lack lustre and sad. There's no doubt it's difficult to watch when there's such a rift between them.

Seeing Kevin again was no surprise. Death doesn't mean you're off the show after all. :) I was pleased that at least he had a purpose for being there and I'm seriously glad they resolved the storyline with Mrs T. But wow - tortured for a year? Man, this show can be so cruel.

It was nice to see Mrs Tran again. I'm really glad the fact she was mentioned early in the season led somewhere. Though making Sam out to be stupid by not knowing which wires to cut in order to make her look kickass was cheap. Wasn't Sam a handyman when Dean was in Purgatory? And isn't like some sort of brainiac? He'd know all about wiring….sheesh.

The angel story line doesn't particularly interest me but I did like Cas's development. Becoming a different kind of leader than he was before makes some sense and isn't unexpected. He'll no doubt lead the charge to restore heaven. We're beginning to see a confident, competent and compassionate Cas - which I rather like. I wonder if he'll ever stop looking puzzled though?

And I can't help feel sorry for all those vessels. The human collateral. :(

Ok. So I gotta talk about SamnDean.

I have to admit I was feeling a little deflated by the end of the episode. I liked that Sam is still rightly pissed and walked away but this episode gave us a pretty clear indication that it's Sam who holds this relationship to ransom and therefore he's the one who'll have to approach Dean and say sorry and forgive him. That continues to worry me and I will be bitterly disappointed if it's resolved this way. That's not to say I want to continue to watch them like this. It's bloody depressing. I've never felt less joy watching an episode before. The last time I felt this down about them being together was after their reunion in S8. Just being together for the sake of it. *sniff*

As much as Kevin's speech made me want to say "yes yes"and slap them both upside the head it would be terribly disappointing if this is all resolved by Sam instantly forgiving Dean or Sam saying sorry for being pissed at him. If they have opened this huge can of worms I can only hope they deal it with the satisfactorily.

There was something that gave me a little bit of hope though (or it might be despair, depending which way it plays out).

Mrs Tran talked about Kevin being her responsibility and it was her right to take her son with her, even if it meant it could turn bad for Kevin. She said it was her responsibility to keep him safe. I felt this was directly related to how Dean feels about Sam. It's his right to keep Sam safe and so he'll do what he has to do.

This depressed me at first because I thought this could be vindicating Dean's actions. Mrs Tran and Kevin were the happy picture of "family" and the message seemed to be - if you have a responsibility it's ok to make choices that could turn bad.

But now I wonder if maybe this is being set up for a future episode where Kevin does actually begin to change and suffer and Mrs Tran has to make a choice about letting him go? Will Dean be the one to convince her to let Kevin go and maybe begin to understand what letting go and holding on means? Probably not - but I'm hoping there's something more here than Mrs Tran and Kevin ascending the stairs to a "perfect" family life (well, as perfect as a ghost and human sharing a life can be).

Either way, I'm sure we'll see Kevin and Mrs T again.

But wow. How so depressing Show… :( I love the angst but without the fire it's just plain sadness.


Other than that….

I did love that both boys were yelling for each other when the ghost activity started. No matter what personal issues are between them they still care very much about what happens to the other. And Sam saved Dean. A small, unsung moment but it was there. (\o/)

At the end it was nice that we saw that moment of hesitation from Sam as he came to his room - it would have been even nicer to have been able to go inside with him. How interesting it might have been to be able to share his pain for a moment. As usual we get to share Dean's and it was interesting how hardened he looked. It wasn't a sadness, but rather a determination to not approach Sam on the matter either. Sam made it clear it's not going to be resolved by simply "moving on" and Dean was honouring that.

The boys looked weary. Shaving is clearly too much of a chore when you're fighting your brother. ;)

I was strangely unmoved by Dean's apology to Kevin. I'm not sure why. It might be because I get that Dean is gutted by what happened but instead of saying sorry I want to see him understand things on a deeper level and really work out what he has to be sorry for. But…*shrugs*…I'm not sure how they're going to be playing that out. I just have to be patient I think.

Both boys were in tight shirts in the beginning. I think we have to appreciate what's really important in this episode. ;) And Sam with a sword = *guh* (though, um… sword vs ghost? Lead sword maybe?)

It's always great to have show back, but boy I look forward to feeling joy after watching an episode rather than sadness.

(I have comments to answer on my recent post but I've run out of time tonight. Thanks for your interesting thoughts though. I swear I will let this go. One day.)

Comments

[quickreaver.livejournal.com]

I'm with you; this ep felt dour. But that's probably appropriate, given where the Winchesters are at right now.

Really, the only thing that truly bugged me about it was Sam-centric. (Surprise, surprise.) Once again, we get almost none of his POV and apparently, his brain has leaked out his ears at some point. This is purely writing flaws. I like Berens' scripts well enough but I wish the show would figure out who Sam is these days.

But man, do I love Dean's beard! And the Trans were wonderful. So pretty solid ep.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Yes - dour is the word. Anything else would have felt wrong so I'm glad what had gone before seeped through every scene.

And yeah, this was a really good example of not getting much go Sam's POV. The closest we came was how forcefully he shut his door. There's still a lot of anger there.

AND there was some Dean in peril…(and some villain monologuing) so there were some other highlights….;D

[borgmama1of5.livejournal.com]

The pause before Sam went in his room gives me the tiniest hope. Also the fact that as soon as something started happening in the bunker they started yelling for each other--no matter how broken, they're first instinct is each other--that has got to mean they're fixable!

No matter which one 'breaks' first to fix the situation, though, half of fandom is going to be pissed.

I don't care, I just want them back together!

[suebsg9.livejournal.com]

I like Dean was already starting to honor Kevin's wishes and talk it out with Sam which they need to do but I think Sam needs to hear Dean out and not walk out when he thinks his final say is it. And sam also needs to stick to issue at hand not go off on some tangent on all the wrong doings dean has done. But I wonder if Dean is staying in different room farther from Sam because that is not the one with mom's pic in it and weapons on the wall. I miss that room. So I wonder if Dean moved farther from Sam just to be all business like and give him the space he needs. But if Sam wants to talk it out he has to listen to Dean and Dean has to listen to Sam. There has to be no leaving when they do start this things might get said about what happend but I think when it does happen alot of things will be resolved. I just think its hard for Dean to be brother and caretaker since he has been caretaker for so long for Sam and maybe this might be good for them that the business like stuff may get Dean to see hey maybe Sam can take care of himself and he doesn't need me. Sorry just thinking out loud.

[amberdreams.livejournal.com]

Swords are steel = iron so better than a poker.

That out of the way - mmm interesting idea that maybe they are thinking of using Kevin & his Mum to show Dean about letting go - I like that idea. Something/somebody has to show Dean that saving Sam at any cost is not right. I wanted to underline the "at any cost" but can't remember the HTML!

I too was unmoved by Dean's apology - in fact, my reaction was similar to Kevin's - oh no, not more Dean angsting! I'm getting annoyed with him now, all this shouldering the blame/responsibility yet not really taking care of these other people when it comes to the crunch, it's not good enough, Deano.

Finally - don't let it go! In the meantime, we need your insights!

[caranfindel.livejournal.com]

I'm conflicted about this one and I need to mull it over like you do (though that didn't stop me from posting a reaction). But no matter what else we get from this episode, it did give us Sam wielding a sword, and that's a GOOD THING.

[tebtosca.livejournal.com]

I thought it was a solid episode (although I'm a bit biased because Berens and I have bonded over twitter and I think he's a doll lol) in that it was well-paced, progressed the mytharc in an interesting way (I like that the human souls are trapped in the veil), and the character interactions felt pretty natural.

I will say that I'm a bit confused at the moment about what the show's POV is. Mama Tran quite clearly reiterated Dean's POV, then Kevin pulled a "Boo Hoo Princess" Bobby speech and mocked Dean's emo manpain. So is Sam's POV, the one that says "fuck you, I don't have to suck up what has happened to me", the show's POV? I'm not quite sure yet.

I will say that two things seem clear to be now after this episode. The first is that they are isolating Dean emotionally in order to take him on some kind of darkside arc. I would bet money that's where we are heading, so I do think that not only do they need to stretch out the reconciliation between he and Sam, but I don't think they are going to make it as easy as "Sam sucks it up and forgives Dean."

The second is that Cas is being setup to eventually take over Heaven and correct what the corrupt angels had done to it. I think the brief glimpse of humanity was not about him eventually choosing to be human again, but about him finally having the final piece of the puzzle that will allow him to understand what God intended when he created them. Also, Misha gets to carry his own separate story so that J2 get all the time off they've been getting this year. Win-win for everyone lol.

I will say that the ending made me feel really bad for Sam. He says something to Dean --fandom rips him apart. He doesn't say something to Dean --fandom still rips him apart. The poor schmuck can't win!

[killabeez.livejournal.com]

And if Dean does have a darkside arc, it's quite plain now that that's Sam's fault, too.

[tebtosca.livejournal.com]

Not really. If anything, it'll be the fault of Dean's tendency to act now-think later. I do think the show is leaning towards showing how that is the wrong way for him to be.

p.s. Almost Human boyssssss <3

[harrigan.livejournal.com]

But now I wonder if maybe this is being set up for a future episode where Kevin does actually begin to change and suffer and Mrs Tran has to make a choice about letting him go? Will Dean be the one to convince her to let Kevin go and maybe begin to understand what letting go and holding on means?

Oh! If only...!

All in all, I liked the ep. (Except for the jarring bounces to the angel drama. I really do like the idea that heaven needs to be re-opened so that souls can find peace, but I'm not very invested in that being outside the Sam-n-Dean storyline.)

I thought Kevin and Mrs. Tran rocked! And since I know the rift between Dean and Sam can't be easily healed, I was prepared for the 'dour' tone of the episode, but I felt that Dean's disappointment that Sam had left the room and Sam's lingering at his door each lead me to hold onto some hope that they are *slowly* moving toward reconciliation.

(As for who needs to listen to/apologize to whom to what degree, I won't take up more space. But ditto to everything you've said here and elsewhere.)

[chomaisky.livejournal.com]

I've become so conscious of my impatience with Dean's pain recently, I tried so hard to rekindle my love for him in various ways, but tonight I got distracted by Sam's eagerness to leave the scene. Is it my illusion, or are his lines getting fewer and fewer...

[cassiopeia7.livejournal.com]

I look forward to feeling joy after watching an episode rather than sadness.

Oh, wow. Yes. I thought it was only me, but . . . yes.

maybe this is being set up for a future episode where Kevin does actually begin to change and suffer and Mrs Tran has to make a choice about letting him go? Will Dean be the one to convince her to let Kevin go and maybe begin to understand what letting go and holding on means?

Though I don't want to see Kevin end up like Bobby, they've got to be leading up to something, and your comment makes perfect sense. That's one ball they really can't afford to drop, and having Kevin's plight be a catalyst for Dean . . . wow. That'd be awesome.

And yeah, as I mentioned on my post, Sam's moment of hesitation was wonderful and links nicely to Linda Tran's moment of hesitation, followed by determination to see the job through.

[quickreaver.livejournal.com]

I like these thoughts a lot.

[cassiopeia7.livejournal.com]

I will say that the ending made me feel really bad for Sam. He says something to Dean --fandom rips him apart. He doesn't say something to Dean --fandom still rips him apart. The poor schmuck can't win!

Too damned true!

[amberdreams.livejournal.com]

Sam hasn't had much to say for most of the season - well I feel it's been that way. Early season I kept saying I missed Sam... Now, I don't know if it's got any worse or is about the same.

[quickreaver.livejournal.com]

Is it my illusion, or are his lines getting fewer and fewer...

I have two thoughts on this. One, both Jared and Jensen have young families and they want to get a little more time off to spend with them and two, I don't think the show knows who Sam Winchester is, now that he isn't possessed or suffering hallucinations or acting as some sort of plot device. So it's really hard to write him.

My two cents.

[de-nugis.livejournal.com]

I'm kind of confuddled about what they are doing with Dean. They brought him to a point where they could have done a redemption arc, or where they could do a darkside arc. Narratively, either would work. But so far he's just kind of plonked himself down in the place where he is and done nothing. It's kind of surreal. I mean, obviously Dean is there with all his Dean emoceans, but as far as the impetus of the story goes, I feel almost like I'm watching Sam react to an empty space or an inanimate object, because there's nothing coming from Dean that can make a story, nothing of change or the possibility of change. It's almost surreal, though I'm not expressing it well. We should be asking if this is going to be Dean's damnation or his salvation, and it feels like we're getting "Eh, probably neither, really. Sam may stop being mad anyway. Or maybe he won't. Or maybe we'll have an episode about aardvarks."

Meanwhile, Sam's grey v-neck shirt does good things for his nipples.

[amberdreams.livejournal.com]

"I will say that the ending made me feel really bad for Sam." Yup - I want them to reconcile but not at any cost. I really hope they will do it right. (They being the writers not the characters!).

Mmm and I hope you are right about the dark mark - and I'd like to see Sam save Dean after lots of hurt Dean moments.

[chomaisky.livejournal.com]

Ugh, that's sad :(

[amberdreams.livejournal.com]

i just noticed your emoceans - AWESOME! Made me grin like a loon.

[tebtosca.livejournal.com]

Honestly, I think it's just Carver's pacing issues, season-wide. I'm sure they are going to stretch it out and then drop hints (I'm betting we start getting small references to the Mark soon, or Dean acting funny) and then it'll culminate in the last 2 or 3 episodes of the season. It's the same way they refuse to sit the boys down and have them talk it out -- because reconciliation this soon takes away the dramatic tension they need for the end of the season (and beyond? Maybe)

I can't pretend that I didn't watch that opening scene a few times just for that grey shirt.

[amberdreams.livejournal.com]

I think both of those points are true. Also I get the feeling that Jared is less defensive (not sure if that is the right word) of Sam as a character than Jensen is of Dean. Otherwise I might have hoped that Jared would be pressing the writers to do something other than just keep making Sam be someone else this week. Possessed by demons, occupied by Hallucifer, an angel condom, soulless...

[gidgetgal9.livejournal.com]

You know I just wanted you to know that I have enjoyed the last two posts and share your thoughts. Thanks for sharing with us!:)

[percysowner.livejournal.com]

I'd agree if anyone, anyone (possibly including Crowley but I'd prefer a "good" character) voiced the slightest criticism of Dean. Instead everyone is fluffing the special relationship and Dean just being too trusting and too loving while telling Sam to just get over it.

[antrazi.livejournal.com]

The whole episode felt so damn bleak and tiring and I just hope it get's better. It was a solid episode but I'm really missing Gamble at the moment. Whatever one may thing about her as an Executive Producer, she was a great writer and really good at writing Sam, giving us his side.