8.23 reaction/review (finally!)

[ash48]

Boo! What a shitty time for LJ to be down. I haven't been able to post and I've wanted to chat!



Well, I gotta say I ended up being more satisfying in the finale than I anticipated. I didn't think I was going to be by the way it started, but by the end I felt we had arrived somewhere.

My thoughts that are all over the place. There were somethings that worried me, some things that bored me, some things that delighted me and some things I FUCKING LOVED!

Off the bat I have to say how impressed I was with Mark and Jared's performances. I had a tear a few times during this episode - one when Sam was about to confess (I was just imagining what he was saying…*sob*), one when Crowley asked about forgiveness and one at the end when Sam tells Dean how much he's let him down. *SOB* I also have to commend Jensen on his sincerity in *that* scene. It must get harder and harder to pull that off, but I think he nailed it. (and of course…SQUEEEEEE awesome brother moment AND another hug!!! S8 = Hug!Season).

I was worried for this episode because it had such a lot to do. For me it was about making some sense of the whole season. I am pleasantly surprised that it mostly DID help me make sense of some of the season. It by no means "fixed" a lot that was wrong with the season (unevenness, retconning, forgetting past canon, misdirected character arcs etc. etc.) but it did help me understand a couple of things.

And I cried. Crying during a Supernatural episode is often a signal that it worked. Weird I know. What can I say? I'm seriously hooked on this show.


All the things….

The "Wayward Son" opening was rather interesting. I laughed out loud to the "lay your weary head to rest" with shots of them cutting off monsters heads. HA! It made me think of them "laying" the Leviathan story line to rest actually. Which is pretty much what they've done. Hardly a mention of them in the entire season.

Recapping Dean saying Purgatory was "pure" and Sam not looking for Dean being mentioned made me very excited. It signaled that they were significant moments and would be revisited in the finale. YAY!

As soon, AS SOON as I saw Jody I yelled NOOOOOOOO at the TV. NO NO they can't kill Jody. I will forgive them Sarah because it was a tactical move (I know, I am cold hearted) but Jody was crossing the line. I am assuming she's not dead. NOT DEAD! But I have to applaud show for using her, because after killing Sarah in the last episode it was a very real threat that they would kill Jody. I really thought they would do it. Bastards!

UGH! Dean listing "losing your soul" as one of Sam's sins. OUCH! Um….wasn't it Cas who pulled Sam out of the cage without his soul? I got all the other "sins" but that one really stung. Sam didn't "lose" his soul (the relevance of this line became clear later of course, so yeah I get why it was used).

I think before I say more I have to make it clear that I watch this show for the brothers and their amazing brother bond (ha! I'm sure you already know that *g*). I enjoy the plot lines and all the other characters but if the brotherness isn't there I pretty much lose interest. I'm saying this because the next section is essential to this understanding.

When the Cas and Metaron scenes started up I admit to sighing and thinking we were going to have to sit through the 2 angel trials leading up the climax of the episode (and because of the "then" I thought one of the trials would be killing Dean or something) .

When Cas came to Dean for help and Dean LEFT HIS BROTHER I have to say I went into a mini melt down because I seriously was not going to sit through the rest of the episode with Sam doing his own thing and Dean and Cas doing theirs (one of the biggest gripes I have when Cas turns up). When Dean was casually having a drink with Cas at the bar waiting for cupid to turn up while his brother was hurting and curing Crowley I nearly goddam cried!

BUT! It was all for a reason and by the end of the episode I could see all that in context and can see how it was all about getting to the climax. With Dean away from Sam it meant we had him rushing back to him. Cheap, but effective. (I told you I watch for the brotherness yeah?)

I liked that it didn't take long for Cas to find out that Metatron was evol. I mean, COME ON! the signals were all there last week but obviously Cas was too distracted (or something) to see them. Once we got past the rather boring waiting for cupid moment the pace seemed to pick up and we had some momentum.

It wasn't a big surprise that Crowley would be the demon they would cure and even though the way they tricked Crowley was fun, I keep coming back to thinking why the hell doesn't he just KILL THEM. Serious, he knew they had the tablet, surely he just had to flick his wrist and toss them into the air. But, *handwave* no story if he did that. But it's ALWAYS been an issue for me. I needed more of a reason why he just didn't get rid of these two ages ago.

I felt like were we finally seeing Dean and Cas as good friends - it was nice to see that rather than be told about it. I'm glad Dean didn't remain pissed at him because I felt that was a little petulant in the last episode. I mean, he might have had good reason to be pissed but it's pretty well established now that Dean considers Cas "family" and therefore forgiving and forgetting is part of the deal. I mean, I could have done without it in this episode but TPTB are trying to please ALL the fans so we got a lovely mix of something for everyone *g* (and no, I'm not being sarcastic. They clearly DID try and satisfy the Dean/Cas fans as well as the brother fans and even the Dean, Sam 'n Cas fans. I actually think they did a pretty good job of it).

I LOVED the way Crowley subtly changed over the course of his "curing". I really saw a different character emerge. It made me appreciate Mark as an actor much more. It's a shame he wasn't able to bring any subtleties to demon!Crowley because Mark would have rocked it I think. He was evil, brutish (and mostly stupid) and that was that. I am very curious to see what kind of Crowley we will see now. Is he completely cured? Will he be the Winchester's "friend" or disappear into the normal world and become a banker? A social worker - looking after lost fallen angels maybe?

I had trouble keeping track of all the angel stuff (a re-watch is a must) but I was disappointed that Naomi had to die. Amanda was rocking that role and its a shame we won't see her next season. Just when her character seemed to take some shape they offed her. I take it Metatron and Abaddon will be next season's big bads? Shame Abaddon lost her meat suit because she was also amazing in that role. Would love to see her around next season.

Metatron is just plain creepy and sleezy and I don't like him. That's possibly a good thing as he's probably the big bad now, but yuk...*shivers*.

I was really happy to see Kevin again (his mom died? When did that happen?) - I thought they wrote him off and that was that. What a used and abused character. I felt his pain I have to say (we had Cas and Kevin wall slamming. Does that mean we can ship them now? ;D)

But for me the thing THE THING that made this episode for me was the Sam and Dean moment at the end. I honestly didn't think we'd get anything like that - that level of emotion and brotherness, but there it was - at the climax of the episode. Sam was completely and utterly broken and for him to confess that his biggest sin is letting Dean down. I just. THE FEELS! My God! The show actually allowed Sam to have these feelings. TO SAY WHAT HE'S FEELING! Sam must feel like such a loser when it comes to his brother and I am SO GLAD he was able to voice that. And I'm not blaming Dean for that at all. Sam has done plenty of things to let Dean down (including not looking for him…..grrrrr). Sam HAS failed Dean. Sometimes it's been his fault, other times not. It must be something that weighs heavily on him. Maybe it shouldn't but it forms another layer to the complex character that is Sam Winchester.

Suddenly Sam's "I see light at the end of the tunnel" speech makes so much sense. Sam's "light" is showing Dean that he can be trusted - that he is capable and that this is the one thing he won't fail at (though he nearly did and knowing what we know now, how devastating for Sam if he did actually fail). WE (and Dean!) know Sam doesn't always fail, but clearly Sam doesn't see that. :((

And I don't feel like we've been here before. Sure, we've had aaaaallll the angst, we've had Sam come to terms with his faults and failures but I don't believe we've ever had him actually say - the thing that hurts me the most is failing you. Knowing that I will let you down again and you will have to find someone else to trust again. And knowing that all those times we desperately wanted Sam to save Dean (from his deal, from Hell, from Purgatory) it's has finally meant something to his overall character arc. It killed me dead. And Jared friggin' nailed it! Dean thinks he's failed as a big brother (in the past) and now Sam thinks he's failed as a little brother. OH BOYS!! <3

There's so much more to discuss here but I will be doing a season review at some point and I'll look at Sam's character arc then. I will say that it makes more sense of why they lead with Sam not looking for Dean, what they did with Benny and Dean and what they tried to do with Amelia.

I think it's a shame that Dean seemed to be a little sidelined toward the end of the season. Don't get me wrong. I love big brother!Dean TO PIECES, but I think there was a lot more to explore. Maybe they're keeping that until next season. I do feel that Dean was more at one with himself than we've seen in a long time. I keep thinking that that was what he came back from Purgatory with. It's a shame that the season was so uneven, because I think the notion of the "purity" of Purgatory was really important to the development of Dean's character this season. It wasn't consistently explored but as it was highlighted in the "Then" recap I think there is a connection. I just loved how clearly focused Dean was at the end of this episode. He knew exactly the line he wasn't prepared to cross to "save" the world. He sacrificed Hell's Gates being closed for Sam. And every though we know the lengths Dean will go to to save Sam, it's always wonderful to see. LOVE IT!!

And wow - we had the ULTIMATE whumped!Sam and awesome big brother!Dean *hearts* x 1000 (yeah, yeah, I know that doesn't appeal to everyone but it does to me!! so YAAAAY!!).

I wonder if the transformation to Sam has just miraculously stopped? It seems weird that he could "just let it go" - though he did seem to be suffering at the end. I wonder if this is something they will continue to explore next season. Hope so! And how awesome Dean saying "just let it go" - double meaning in those words. Letting the "transformation" go and just let all that emotion go. (GUH!! THAT SCENE!)

I have to say I wasn't surprised that they didn't manage to close the gates of hell. I never felt that was a real possibility. Sam and Dean kept thinking it would be the end of everything if they did this one thing, but that never rang true. It couldn't be the end of them hunting. This time is was all about the journey getting there, not the end goal. Maybe they'll examine what it would actually mean to shut the so called gates. It probably wouldn't really be a good idea after all.

The ending looked beautiful. The effects team did an amazing job. The falling angels were fantastic - we actually got to see the wings. Gorgeous.

So where does that leave us?

Um....a whole heap of new "people" on the planet. What are they going to do with themselves?

Human!Cas So many mixed feelings about this. It will TOTALLY depend on how they chose to play him. If it's for comic relief (a "child" again) I will cry. If it's as a third wheel to the Winchester hunting team I will possibly cry as well - depends how they play it. In fact, I can't think of too many scenarios in which I will be thrilled. Maybe if he DID settle down, get married and have a family I would be happy with that. I dunno. Though I except he'll be wanting his grace back and will need Sam and Dean to help him. Maybe he'll have to "earn" it and actually start acting like a "good" angel. Hmmm...that might be a theme. Angels learning to be angelic instead of dicks. They seemed to have lost their way so this could totally be a thing. I could go with that I think.

Metatron being yuk.

Crowley helping little old ladies across the road.

Abaddon finding a new body (or maybe someone regenerating the burned one?) and being the Queen of Hell.

Cas searching for his grace (and character maybe? As in finding the real Castiel).

Jody making better date choices.

Benny meeting the Vamp Alpha and being awesome together.

Kevin running away to a tropical island and sipping on cocktails.

More about the MoL maybe.

Dean...um...I really don't know. I kinda felt that Dean came into his own this season. There's still the abandonment issues to deal with and maybe not feeling like his whole being is reliant on Sam (and maybe Cas?). He seems to have come to terms a bit more with losing people and the importance of being a hunter, so I think some progress has been made.

Sam...um...oh Sam. I would like to think more will be explored on his almost complete transformation. I want to know what was going on there. He was going to die to close the gates - but now? And what exactly was happening to his body? Then there's coming to terms with what he told Dean. It's something he's kept close to his chest FOREVER, so now that's out of the bag will there be a change? Will Sam no longer feel like he has to prove himself to Dean? - and if so what will that look like? Is it something that's built in to his character - like Dean having to look out for Sam?

I'll wrap it up there. I feel like there's so much more to think and talk about. I'm still working through some of the overall issues but I feel fairly satisfied that something was achieved and that the way is clear for even more to be achieved. I feel better knowing that maybe Carver has put the show in a place he wants and will have a clearer goal for S9.

We'll see!!!

Comments

[colls]

LOL -- I was just coming by to see if you had a recap up and BAM! here it is. A+ timing!! ♥
I'll limit myself to replying about three things, because otherwise I'll leave pages.

- Dean's litany of Sam's sins felt like an intentional bad joke. He knew the things Sam beats himself up over and he just started listing them, then distracted him with some random childhood memory - I think it shifted Sam's focus to being irritated at Dean instead of perseverating on his confession.


- I think many of us knew Cas was going to fall somehow. I'm still rather ambivalent about Castiel becoming a regular (nothing against the character, just worried about how it'll work story-wise) - although not having his angel mojo is really the only way he can be around Sam and Dean in any real capacity wihtout simply stopping in and summoning Dean when he needs help with his heaven problems. Not that I'm annoyed by that scene - ha! Like you, I get that it was needed for the Dean-rushing-back but it's becoming tiresome and I hope we don't get an entire season of that sort of thing next year.
Do the other angels still have their mojo? They fell like Lucifer so I'm thinking yes?
I hope they stop resetting Castiel. If his memories are wiped (again) when the season opens I think I might hurl something at the TV. I'd like some more development of the Sam and Cas friendship to help balance everything always being about Dean and Dean's friends, and it feels like that might happen. *crosses fingers*


- I would've dearly loved to see Abaddon and Naomi at odds and arch rivals and have MoL and hunters caught in the middle of their battle. Probably a retread of the earlier angels and demons line, but genderswapped to some pretty badass bitches. Sad that we probably won't get that (I didn't see Naomi wings?!?! am I the only one clinging to that?) I hope there's fic or something. *sighs*


Also, the batcave going into RED ALERT was awesome.
ETA: and I suppose it goes without saying that I feel the final scenes were worth their weight in gold.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Yay for positive timing! :D

Dean's litany of Sam's sins felt like an intentional bad joke

Oh yes yes. I rather love how flippant Dean was about those and it's not until later we realise the significance of them. So maybe the soul line was meant to a "joke". Hmmm..yes. That makes more sense to me.

I think we all pretty much knew Cas was going to fall and I can't say that concerns me too much - mainly because they had to do something to have him around without him having angel powers. This seems like a good choice IF they do something interesting with it. I'm just at a lost as to what they can do with that. Also, does that mean he's now Jimmy again? I suspect not.

I constantly want something from Cas that I can cling onto. Just when I feel like I have hold he changes. Maybe that's because he's an angel trying to discover himself? I think it could be really interesting - I'm just not sure how they'll work Sam and Dean into it (so long as they work Dean AND Sam into it...)

(I didn't see Naomi wings?!?! am I the only one clinging to that?)

Ooh, good point. Surely a drill in her neck isn't the actual end. *clings*

BATCAVE RED ALERT!! I actually got really worried then because I thought the cave was being invaded. It makes me wonder what "supernatural" qualities the cave has. Clearly something connected with the angels falling. :))

[colls]

I don't believe Dean thinks Sam needs forgiveness for any of those things any longer, he'd told Sam several times that "it wasn't you" when talking about soulless!Sam. It was a nice way to highlight how much Sam still clung to those things in the later scene.

I'm pretty sure Jimmy has officially died, his soul moved on, etc. That could be fanon interpretation though? I'm not sure. I also don't understand what Metatron meant when he mentioned Cas's soul. I didn't think angels had souls? Maybe he does because he doesn't have his grace? Why did I think angels don't have souls....
*wanders off to wiki

THE CAVE IS ALIVE! lol -- Kevin is stranded in command central and the world is falling apart... is it season 9 yet?

Whatever happens, I'd like a bit more external conflict next season and less internal strife. I think I say that every season at least I'm predictable

[ash48.livejournal.com]

I don't believe Dean thinks Sam needs forgiveness for any of those things any longer

It's a tricky one. They obviously needed to take Sam to a place where he reveals a fundamental truth about himself, so Dean had to say those things. It's hard to tell, I think, how much Dean meant it. With the season being all over the place with characterisations it's hard to know for sure if he was "joking" or whether those were still sticking point. Ghost!Dean said all those things to Sam early in the season and Sam just wore them (at the time is pissed me off royally). I think it revealed a lot about what Dean really thinks deep down. Well, that's how I think Sam sees it.

I'm pretty sure Jimmy has officially died, his soul moved on, etc.

I've never been sure about this. I think Misha might have said that he considers Jimmy still alive. In my mind he simply can't be. Hmmm...angels having souls when they don't have their grace. *head hurts* This season has reinvented canon so I'd say anything goes...

HA! Alive cave with Kevin thinking what the hell?! Poor Kevin. That poor needs a break.

I would LOVE to see more external conflict. If they DARE take the boys back to being at odd with each other for NO GOOD REASON I will scream! There's still ground to cover and issues to resolve, but hopefully they can do that without all the unnecessary drama.

I think at least they are in a fairly good place to pick it up without them fighting. Unless Sam does feel like he failed because he didn't finish the trail. ACK! too complicated. /o\

[colls]

I think it revealed a lot about what Dean really thinks deep down. Well, that's how I think Sam sees it.
True.
And it is very likely that Dean still harbors some disappointment about the not-searching thing which fed his (understandable) abandonment issues.

It's almost like the 'Let go' was meant for both of them.

I think at least they are in a fairly good place to pick it up without them fighting.
Yes! This is probably my favorite thing about this finale. Ok, 2nd. 3rd... ;p

[elsewhere91.livejournal.com]

I agree, this finale was so much better than season 7 (and maybe season 6), although it wasn't as heart breaking and tense as the finales from seasons 1-5.

I had really mixed feelings after the first time i watched this episode, but after having watched it a second time it was so much better.

UGH! Dean listing "losing your soul" as one of Sam's sins. OUCH! Um….wasn't it Cas who pulled Sam out of the cage without his soul? I got all the other "sins" but that one really stung. Sam didn't "lose" his soul (the relevance of this line became clear later of course, so yeah I get why it was used

Not me, I still don't understand why Dean was blaming Sam for that.

I think before I say more I have to make it clear that I watch this show for the brothers and their amazing brother bond (ha! I'm sure you already know that *g*). I enjoy the plot lines and all the other characters but if the brotherness isn't there I pretty much lose interest.

I 100% agree, which is why the Metatron and Castiel scenes were quite boring and just had wanting to fast forward their scenes (although it was better to watch their scenes on a rewatch).


When Cas came to Dean for help and Dean LEFT HIS BROTHER I have to say I went into a mini melt down because I seriously was not going to sit through the rest of the episode with Sam doing his own thing and Dean and Cas doing theirs (one of the biggest gripes I have when Cas turns up)

The first time i watched the episode, I was so angry at the scene, because we didn't get to see Sam's confession (and i thought we wouldn't hear what Sam said)and it was replaced with Cas and Dean and i thought once again, that Sam wouldn't get his pov across. I am really happy i was wrong.

But for me the thing THE THING that made this episode for me was the Sam and Dean moment at the end. I honestly didn't think we'd get anything like that - that level of emotion and brotherness, but there it was

Me too. I am so glad that we finally got that scene where Sam was finally able to get his pov and feelings across. It was like what happened in 8.21 with Sam's confession about the demon blood, i knew Sam was thinking it but to just have it revealed, that Sam had doubts and insecurities and feelings, and that he finally revealed to Dean what he was feeling... finally. I have felt at times that Sam needs to have more pov and more conversations about how he is feeling, so i am really glad that we got this.

And I don't feel like we've been here before. Sure, we've had aaaaallll the angst, we've had Sam come to terms with his faults and failures but I don't believe we've ever had him actually say - the thing that hurts me the most is failing you. Knowing that I will let you down again and you will have to find someone else to trust again.

I agree, i just hope that next season, that the relationship grows stronger and that what Sam said doesn't get ignored and they don't just revert back to arguing again.

Human!Cas So many mixed feelings about this. It will TOTALLY depend on who they chose to play him

I agree, if the whole season is another redemption arc, or if he is constantly around Sam and Dean, being around in the back of the Impala..then i won't be happy. If he matures and has his own mission (and hopefully will not have his memory erased...again) and sometimes joins Sam and Dean, then i will be happy-ish.

This season has been uneven, and i have been unhappy with the storylines at times, i'll need to rewatch it to see if i have missed things or if things fall into place, but i have enjoyed it better than season 7. I just hope that season 9 is much more even, and as long as the brothers and their amazing brother bond is front and centre and they are not sidelined by Castiel and the fallen angels than i'll be happy.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Not me, I still don't understand why Dean was blaming Sam for that.

Purely in a plot devise kind of way. I think Sam needed to hear those things from Dean to put into focus what he was going to confess. It was a pretty cheap devise - there to drive the plot (at Dean's expense unfortunately).

I was so angry at the scene, because we didn't get to see Sam's confession (and i thought we wouldn't hear what Sam said)and it was replaced with Cas and Dean and i thought once again, that Sam wouldn't get his pov across. I am really happy i was wrong.

Yes. It hurt my heart that Dean chose Cas over Sam - but in hindsight I can see why. It was such a lovely surprise to actually have Sam's POV. I think that's why that scene meant so much to me.

I agree, i just hope that next season, that the relationship grows stronger and that what Sam said doesn't get ignored and they don't just revert back to arguing again.

Word. And after having a discussion elsewhere I've realised that Dean only told Sam that Sam means everything to him (which Sam already knew), what he didn't tell him was that he trusted him and believed in him. I think that might be a growth area for both of them next next season.

If he matures and has his own mission (and hopefully will not have his memory erased...again) and sometimes joins Sam and Dean, then i will be happy-ish.

That would be refreshing. Mostly I could do without them having to find a story line for Cas at all but he's here to stay so I am at least hoping they can do something interesting with him.

I hope S9 is more even also. I'm hoping that because Carver has put the show where he wants it, he has a clear idea of a way forward. And it's great to see the brother's relationship is important to him. I had major concerns for that in the beginning.

[cassiopeia7.livejournal.com]

When Cas came to Dean for help and Dean LEFT HIS BROTHER I have to say I went into a mini melt down because I seriously was not going to sit through the rest of the episode with Sam doing his own thing and Dean and Cas doing theirs (one of the biggest gripes I have when Cas turns up).

This, this, a million times this. And worse than all the OTHER times Dean has left Sam to traipse off of one of Castiel's missions . . . this time, he left a very ill Sam alone with one of the sneakiest demons they know, only to end up sitting at a bar with Castiel, drinking beer. How did Dean not see anything wrong with this?

UGH! Dean listing "losing your soul" as one of Sam's sins. OUCH! Um….wasn't it Cas who pulled Sam out of the cage without his soul?

I kinda wanted to smack Dean for that -- and I'm a Dean!girl.

But for me the thing THE THING that made this episode for me was the Sam and Dean moment at the end. I honestly didn't think we'd get anything like that - that level of emotion and brotherness, but there it was - at the climax of the episode.

And for me, the Sam and Dean moment was the thing that SAVED this episode. The
"meh" parts were beginning to outnumber the "awesome" parts, then came this incredible scene, and I was won over. ;)

Human!Cas So many mixed feelings about this. It will TOTALLY depend on who they chose to play him. If it's for comic relief (a "child" again) I will cry. If it's as a third wheel to the Winchester hunting team I will possibly cry as well - depends how they play it. In fact, I can't think of too many scenarios in which I will be thrilled.

I hate to say it, but . . . THIS. :( Castiel hasn't quite fit since S6, but the writers keep jamming him in there anyway. I quite like him when written properly (circa S4-5), and it'd be nice if the writers could figure out a way to work him into the plot in a more "organic" manner. And yes, I will spit nails if he lands permanently in the Impala's backseat or if there are any more idiotic egg scenes. (Didn't S4 Castiel say something about being on Earth for 2000 years? How the HELL did he not know what an egg was?) IDK, maybe they could fit him in as a Bobbyish font of supernatural knowledge? I suspect it'll be the same old same old, but maybe we'll be pleasantly surprised? *hopes*

Abaddon finding a new body (or maybe someone regenerating the burned one?) and being the Queen of Hell.

I vote for the "regeneration" option. I really like the actress's portrayal and don't want to see Abaddon in another meatsuit. Also? Bring back that tee-shirt! :)

Benny meeting the Vamp Alpha and being awesome together.

Oh, I want this SO badly! Alas, the only way this could happen is if the Alpha Vamp dies and goes to Purgatory (noes!), or Benny manages to find another trapped human and escape again.

[callistosh65.livejournal.com]

Crying during a Supernatural episode is often a signal that it worked Amen to that! Mark Shepard made me tear up first - SO fine in those broken momets where human Crowley starts to come through. I truly was on the edge of my seat. And Jared, yes. Be still my heart at how wrecked and awful and brilliant he was throughout - and all that angst is not easy to give a new twist to, but he did. In spades.

I do wonder where the angel storyline will go.. my problem is, trying to care about it.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

I do wonder where the angel storyline will go.. my problem is, trying to care about it.

ha! Oh me to. What I'm hoping is that it leaves them A LOT of time to be hunting the run of the mill monsters. I want lots of MoTW eps, with the brothers working together and getting the job done. I know they have to have an overall arc, which seems to be an angel one, so hopefully they can do something interesting with it.

*hearts* jared so so much.
xx

[jessm78.livejournal.com]

But for me the thing THE THING that made this episode for me was the Sam and Dean moment at the end.

Oh GOD, yes. SO much love. <3 <3 <3

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Wheeeee! Yes! <33

[growyourwings.livejournal.com]

Just YES to all of this. I think I'll just link to this on my LJ and say (yet again) What she said!

I've been thinking about the brother scene at the end and how much Sam was hurting about Dean choosing others before him. It occurred to me that perhaps (just *perhaps* a *little) this could be stretched to perhaps (did I stress perhaps enough?) as a motivation for the "Sam did not look for Dean" crap. In his unconscious psyche, did Sam choose to not look for Dean not only due to PTSD making him OOC but because he was bone weary about feeling like he never measured up anyway? (And perhaps, stretching, but it was a thought.)

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Thanks hun!

In his unconscious psyche, did Sam choose to not look for Dean not only due to PTSD making him OOC but because he was bone weary about feeling like he never measured up anyway?

Yes yes. I think, it is extremely possible. In fact, I think I remember Jared saying something Sam feeling "free" or something along those lines when Dean was gone. I didn't want to accept it because it's so hard to hear that Sam wouldn't want Dean around, but I am sure there was a certain about of relief that he no longer had to prove himself to his big brother. In fact, it's been my head canon for a while and after that finale it's easier to understand.

Oh Sam. :((

xox

[alienat.livejournal.com]

I'm just gonna agree with everything you said. Right now I kinda feel like I felt when watching Lord of the Rings - The Two Towers in the cinema and having to wait for a year for the story to play out completely. At least this time it's only four months. LOL

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Oh hey! Really? We agree about this one? Woot! :))

The hellatus sucks! I can't wait to see where they pick it up (no one year later at least!! *G*). I'm wondering if Sam will still be sick...

xox

[greyowl88.livejournal.com]

Before I read or say anything else:

OMG! THAT LAST SCENE! ANGELS FALLING OUT OF THE SKY!! That was just amazing!! :D \o/

*settles down*

First I have to say I managed to really let this episode take me with it. (Enjoying the ride once again.) I was in a much better place than last week and even managed to excuse Castiel's behaviour from last week with that he was injured badly enough to not be able to fly and that maybe the tablet being ripped out of him affected his brain. (How that can be possible? No idea. Who cares? It satisfied me. ;) )

*reads your post*

When Cas came to Dean for help and Dean LEFT HIS BROTHER I have to say I went into a mini melt down

Me too! I thought they were going to screw up this ep. lol. But then the angel trials turned out to be a lot of bs and Metatron had this evil plan. :D

Oh man, Crowly. I loved how he changed from the injections. And the way Sam looked at him when he stated he just wants to be loved. It all felt so intense and real. When Abbadon came in I first thought, oh no, she'll free Crowly and all my excitement will be gone. But Sam just snuffed her and carried on. How cool is that?! :D

But for me the thing THE THING that made this episode for me was the Sam and Dean moment at the end. I honestly didn't think we'd get anything like that - that level of emotion and brotherness, but there it was - at the climax of the episode.

Omg! Yes!!! ♥♥♥ *has nothing to add*

I wonder if the transformation to Sam has just miraculously stopped? It seems weird that he could "just let it go

I thought that was because of the angels falling out of the sky losing their angel mojo. So Sam lost this heavenly light he had in him from the trials. That light was why he resonated with Metatron, getting this ringing in his ear since the angels are of heavenly light. (Sorry if anybody else said that before, I haven't read any comments yet.)

I hope they write a good story for Castiel so I don't have to make my own stories to be able to still love him. lol

I'll certainly have to watch the episode again, of course. I think I can make time tomorrow. :D

xox

[ash48.livejournal.com]

The angels falling was beautiful. That whole scene was beautifully done.

The scenes between Mark and Jared were simply amazing. So powerful. They seemed to really work well together. For the first time in forever, I actually enjoyed watching Mark. ;)

So Sam lost this heavenly light he had in him from the trials. That light was why he resonated with Metatron, getting this ringing in his ear since the angels are of heavenly light

Oh yes yes of course. His new pain started as the angels started to fall. So yeah - I can understand this. It also means that Sam should no longer be suffering at the start of the new season (boo...;D). Sam was reacting physically to the angels falling so..yeah...THANKS!! I didn't actually make that connection.

I sincerely hope they write a good story for Castiel. I want to start liking him again...

I'll probably be rewatching that finale scene a HEAP! :DD

xoxox

[greyowl88.livejournal.com]

It also means that Sam should no longer be suffering at the start of the new season (boo...;D).

LOL at the boo. haha. Give poor Sammy a break, will ya?! ;D

[ash48.livejournal.com]

HA! I know... I'm so mean to poor Sam. Time I gave him a break..;)

[cloex-brosluvr.livejournal.com]

I was going to quote and comment 'yes...agreed...true' on what I liked but that was most of your whole post. :D


So... "YES; OMG I AGREE; THAT IS 100% SO TRUE; *facebook like*" to your post.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Thanks. :) I think a "like" button would be handy on LJ sometimes (I know it's available but I don't know how to activate it).

xox

[runedgirl.livejournal.com]

Ahhhh, thanks for this review. You know I'm right there with you in judging an episode on its SamnDean-ness. This one delivered times a million.

I think Dean did mean the things he suggested to Sam as his 'sins', but in the sense that we all hang onto hurts from the people who mean the most to us, even when we know we really shouldn't. Most of it wasn't Sam's fault - or it was at least understandable given the circumstances - but that doesn't mean it didn't hurt. And Dean hangs onto those things.

I feel like their conversation brought a bit of closure to both of them - they both really heard each other, and felt the other's love. They chose each other, pure and simple. Annnnnnnd now I'm tearing up again.... :)

[ash48.livejournal.com]

SO MUCH SAMNDEANESS!! (well at the end anyway...;D)

Dean saying what he said to Sam about his sins has been an interesting topic of discussion. I think there's it can be either looked at as necessary because of the way the story unfolded at the end and/or that Dean has actually been harboring this feelings toward Sam for a long time. I think it was partially a way of "joking" to lighten the mood, a way of reminding Sam of what he's done and a way to drive Sam to make his ultimate confession.

They chose each other, pure and simple

Yes yes. Sam actually chose to live and stay with Dean. He could have completed that final stage of the trial and make the pain all go away. But he trusted Dean (as he's nearly always done) and chose to live. And Dean always choses Sam. Every. Single. Time. <333

THESE TWO!!! I love that we had the very scene that reminds me why I love this show so much.

xx

[hugemind.livejournal.com]

I keep coming back to thinking why the hell doesn't he just KILL THEM

I'm chalking it up to the Evil Overlord Monologue complex. The need to rub your victories and smugness in someone's face.

Metatron is just plain creepy and sleezy and I don't like him. That's possibly a good thing as he's probably the big bad now

It could be that he'll learn in S9 that power corrupts, but he didn't seem to have an agenda beyond getting revenge from being driven out of heaven.

we had the ULTIMATE whumped!Sam and awesome big brother!Dean *hearts* x 1000

YESYESYES.

Human!Cas So many mixed feelings about this. It will TOTALLY depend on how they chose to play him. If it's for comic relief (a "child" again) I will cry.

"Why the hell not bury myself in women and decadence?" Cas, 5x04. ;) I don't want the child thing either, because it's really not that funny and we've seen it before. And he's not a hunter, so having him in the back seat would be pointless. Counseling the fallen angels and teaching them how the world works? Maybe something big happens and angels are needed back in heaven all powered-up and Team Free Will needs to make that happen. I don't know, but I sure as heck am excited! :)

[ash48.livejournal.com]

I'm chalking it up to the Evil Overlord Monologue complex

I'm going with that then. :) I actually think this works for Crowley. I think Sam and Dean is the closest he's come to an actual "relationship" so killing them would remove a lot of the fun. Also, who would he have to say "hello boys" too.

If we had 2014 Cas I would be well amazed. Wouldn't it be awesome to actually see the "The End" being played out in some ways. As a fallen angel he may well become hippy!Cas. I think there are tremendous opportunities to something interesting with Cas now.

xx

[sam-dean-lover.livejournal.com]

I watched, started out ok, rolled my eyes when Dean left his brother to go with Caa-bored from there to the Naomi/Metatron/Cas scenes. then the end i was confused but i got clarification of what happened. (the meteor thing,) i did like the bro moment, then it was all ruined by the writers having Dean blame Sam for losing his soul yada, yada, yada big =( for me. i have something to tell you will send you a pm

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Oh yes - the meteor thing was all the angels falling. Quite a moment.

Oh and thanks for the PM. I did see that around the place. I wonder if that will be good for ratings or not. We'll see I suppose.

xx

[bowtrunckle.livejournal.com]

When Cas came to Dean for help and Dean LEFT HIS BROTHER I have to say I went into a mini melt down

I said, "When you split up Bad Things happen! Argghh!" Then I couldn't believe it when Dean was leisurely drinking beer at the bar and causally conversing with Cas. I see why the writers had to manufacture that separation, but it felt like a step back for Sam and Dean.

And knowing that all those times we desperately wanted Sam to save Dean (from his deal, from Hell, from Purgatory) it's has finally meant something to his overall character arc.

BINGO! Yes. \o/\o/\o/ Thank you for pointing this out because I was only seeing "Sam failed again" and getting all hot and bothered because, geez, he can't seem to catch a self-esteem break ever. But I think it's just a residual of me being indignant about Sam not getting Dean out of Hell when it was relatively easy for him to rescue Bobby.

I feel better knowing that maybe Carver has put the show in a place he wants and will have a clearer goal for S9.

I can only hope. I feel like I've been making up excuses all season for the writing team, but I (again) find myself saying things like maybe this was just a really, really long and painful show-runner transition and they'll find their footing by next season.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Then I couldn't believe it when Dean was leisurely drinking beer at the bar and causally conversing with Cas.

That was the thing I couldn't understand at all. Dean knew what Sam was going through. I know Dean actually does trust Sam to be able to do the job, but I'm sure he would have been a little apprehensive.

because I was only seeing "Sam failed again" and getting all hot and bothered

Oh, I didn't see this as another Sam failure (God, I hope it's not going to be played like that). I think this was more about use understanding why Sam was so willing to take on these trials in the first place. It was a chance for him to prove himself to Dean - to make Dean believe in him. He only stopped because Dean begged him to. And I think Sam really wouldn't want to hurt Dean like that. More than anything I think Sam does everything he can to try not to hurt Dean. It just backfires sometimes. ;(

I sincerely hope they find their footing next season. I feel that they had some good intentions this season but the unevenness in the writing let them down. Let's hope they can play it out more solidly for next one. ;)

xx

[borgmama1of5.livejournal.com]

What a mixed up season...some really great stuff, some really WTF stuff...the number of times the writers ignored canon, especially when it would have been one or two sentences to make it work...but Jensen and Jared make Dean and Sam worth it regardless of the plot holes :)

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Yeah. So mixed up. But Jensen and Jared seem so committed and tbh, I could watch them together forever. They had chemistry to start with but now they have familiarity and a deep respect and trust for each other that it really shines through.

[novakev.livejournal.com]

I bounced between squee and being bored. Every scene of Sam was superb, and Crowley was delicious.

The brother moments really do make the show! I greatly enjoyed the scene, but did Dean really have to tell Sam what to confess? The real brother moment of the season - no words, just...feels!

I agree the ending was done beautifully.

My expectations for the new season are not hopeful. An angel arc; human Cas; dropping the Trials arc with no explanation of consequences; and could it be possible that Dean will have faith in Sam? Let Sam know he's trusted and loved?

Of course, I'll still be looking forward to season 9 because we have to have these brothers together forever!!!!

[ash48.livejournal.com]

The Sam and Crowley scenes were certainly engaging - so intense and the acting was superb.

dropping the Trials arc with no explanation of consequences

It will be interesting to see what they do with this. I suspect it will be dropped because there's no where to go with it. Sam will die if he finishes the last one so that's pretty much a dead end. I hope it isn't dropped without at least some reference to it. I'd like them to explore the consequences of actually shutting the gates to heaven and hell. I suspect doing that might have dire consequences for the planet. Maybe?

I'm wondering if Sam will actually have to DO something for Dean do really (really) trust him. I think there's room to explore both Dean knowing that he needs to show Sam that he trusts him and for Sam to start believing that for himself.

I'm pretty excited for S9. Much more excited than I was going into S8.
xx

[novakev.livejournal.com]

Sam will die if he finishes the last one so that's pretty much a dead end.

My problem with Dean's "Metatron lied" line is that the tablet stated the One to do the trials were not to fear death, and it was written when he was just transcribing the word of God, not a disillusioned bitter angel; that came later.

It also means that Dean believed Naomi with nothing but her word.

Then there's Sam's illness which they figured would go away with finishing the Trials. Sam, himself, think its purifying him, so why would he stop. It seems there should be more. I liked Sam collapsing at the end and I hope they show how he overcomes this.