9.03 reaction/review

[ash48]

When that episode finished the first words out of my mouth were "well, that sucks".

I was specifically referring to the final scene but actually it sums up how I felt about most of that episode I'm afraid.

All I really need to say is "Brad Buckner & Eugenie Ross-Leming". As soon as I saw those writers names I worried what kind of episode we might be in for. They lived up to my opinion of them unfortunately. (I am still down on them for Taxi Driver).

It doesn't help that I didn't find the episode particularly interesting - but I can let that go because I'm not going to find every episode interesting. And that's cool. It's more that there were too many dumb things in it.

The thing that bugged me MORE THAN ANYTHING was Dean not knowing "It's a Wonderful Life". A small characterisation issue, but come on! This is the man who practically talks in movie quotes (with often random character references - "Katniss" last week, for example) and he didn't know who Clarence was? Dean would not only know that movie he would love it! (Surely it's one of the most famous Christmas movies ever?!) I was pretty forgiving of things up until that point and then I was grumpy. Which probably effected how I viewed the rest.

There were some things I liked so I'll mentioned those before mentioning the stuff that annoyed me.

As much as I'm not a huge Cas fan, it was actually a couple of his scenes I liked the best (I know!). I was specifically moved when Cas was looking in the bin of food and mentioned the waste. I felt Misha's heart in that line and it made me sad. As did that lovely long shot of him on the street. I figured the approach to Cas this season would be him discovering what all angels seem to not know and that is what it means to be human. It could be a nice development that Cas actually becomes the "important" angel he wants to be by teaching/showing other angels what it is to be, well, a "proper" angel. And yay - no comic relief. Some amusing moments, but not over the top.

Dean's look of utter glee at Cas having sex made me smile. It was almost like he was proud. His angel is growing up (which lines up with my feeling below that Dean and Cas are more like father and son at the moment). The fact that Cas has been married in the past - and probably had sex, has been forgotten by all I think. AND the fact that Cas had sex with an angel vessel wouldn't have crossed his mind.

Sam got Dean food and pie. That's always nice.

Dean in dressing gown. Comfy Dean is nice also.

Dean picked Sam over Cas - I have extremely mixed feelings about this but it is a brother moment that's worth mentioning (though Dean picking Sam over anybody isn't a surprise any more. It just is). More on this later.

Sam's pink shirt. It's was just so loud, it made me smile.

Bat cave. Also great to see the cave.

Um...that's it I'm afraid. So turn back now if you don't want to hear all the bits I was grumpy with.

Dean

I have been extremely forgiving of what Dean did in order to get Sam well. It's all part of that messed up crazy love and I love the complexity of that issue. But now it's just plain creepy and feeling more wrong to me. Last week I was ok that Sam was out of it when Zeke appeared. Sam's life was in danger and there was no other option. But now Zeke is coming out either when he feel like it, or when Dean asks him to. Sam is being used and I have to say I felt pretty uncomfortable about that. Of course, this may well be adding to the upcoming story line so I'll be patient to see how that pans out (especially with Sam making comments like "body snatchers").

Why is Dean being so trusting of Zeke? It makes no sense now. Sam is clearly much better (up early, eating and running etc) so why the hell would he a) not tell Sam about Zeke and b) kick Cas out on Zeke's say so. I can only think that Sam really isn't well enough (though how does Dean know that?!) and Zeke has to stay there. I get he can't yet but I want to believe it but seeing it. Zeke had enough juice to bring Cas from the dead, so he seems plenty powerful and could probably leave Sam - or at least that should be questioned by Dean.

Dean is getting pretty comfortable with lying to Sam now. He's not great at it (never been great at lying to Sam), but he doesn't seem too concerned about what's going on with him. I am blaming this on either Jensen being poorly directed (and therefore not bringing out those conflicting nuances he did in the first two episodes) or Dean is actually feeling ok about what he's done. I liked that we could see conflict last week. It was almost a joke to bring Zeke out - and I was quite shocked that Dean did that actually. It all just felt tasteless to me (I'm ready now for Sam to be thoroughly pissed at Dean for this treatment).

Sam

Sam confused me. Zeke takes over with absolutely no after affects. He's feeling great and not questioning why (Sam would!) and surely he'd be experiencing time lapses (Ok, maybe not but Zeke popping in and out whenever they need a problem solved will get pretty boring after a while I think).

I feel like Sam wasn't in that episode much so there wasn't much to go on. And I'm not going to read too much into this for Sam or Dean - I just don't trust these two writers enough.

I like Jared's Zeke. He's clearly not Sam. Though I'm not sure if the sincerity is something Jared is bringing to the character (can he even help those puppy eyes?!) or if we are meant to be interpreting that as Zeke really being honest.

Cas

Some nice moments and I like seeing Misha without all the layers. Though what's with all the shirtlessness lately? Not complaining, but seems we're making up for lack of it over the years in 2 episodes. :)

Cas really is a child isn't he? He seems full of wonder and really hasn't a clue about humans (I'll *handwave* the fact that he should know them very well) - he's being completely trustworthy and still saying things that he should know humans won't understand. But, I'll accept that as part of the story telling.

When April kissed Cas after such a short time I figured she was an angel (hoped she was as it wasn't making any sense if she wasn't). But then when they had sex and we find out she is a possessed person I was sad. The vessels are being treated so badly lately and this episode was particularly horrible for that. Sure she said yes, but I'm sure she didn't say yes to having sex. Which I'd say was the whole point if I thought they'd even considered that. If they were doing that to raise the issue of what vessels are agreeing when they say yes, I would be cool with it (and if they linked it to what's happening to Sam). Maybe they will later, but clearly this was not the episode for that.

Also - did we ever find out how April found Cas? Just by chance? Probably.

I found Cas's torture particularly difficult. Him being so childlike made me feel like a child was being tortured.

Sam and Dean finally meeting up with Cas was fine. And seeing Cas as such a young human makes me see the way Dean looks at him as a father would to a son. When I think of their relationship like that it makes more sense to me. Dean clearly loves and cares for Cas and seeing the way he responded to Cas having sex with April confirms that for me. That family bond is getting clearer.

Angels

Have we ever been told why angels are such douche bags? With the angels being as evil as demons we may as well just have demons. The girl's body exploding was pretty horrible. Though I think it was an attempt to a) show us how angels are managing to get vessels so easily and b) that humans are expendable and c) angels (in the spn 'verse) are dicks!

Which leads me back to the question - why is Dean trusting Zeke so easily? Does he even know ANY "good" angels?

Other stuff

That final scene.

So. Cas has been missing. Dean (and Sam) have been very worried about him. They find him and know what a horrible time he has had. Show tells us (and tells us and tells us) that Cas is family. That Dean "needs" him. That they are friends. Then on the say so of an unknown angel Dean tells Cas he has to leave. Oh yeah...that makes complete sense. NOT! Especially when we see Cas so helpless and obviously needing their help. I would have at least liked to have seen more of a fight from Dean. That's not to say I'm desperate to have Cas live in the bat cave with them for ever (and for story telling purposes they not only need Cas away from them but they also need to create that drama), but at least have Dean question Zeke more over it (please, show don't make Dean dumb over this!).

Of course, this could make some sense if Sam questions the hell out of Dean's decision in the next episode and Sam starts to query what's going on with Dean. If it's brushed over I'll...dammit, I'll be back to being pissed at show (Unless Zeke is somehow changing Sam and is deliberately dumbing him down...).

ACK! So messy! And I can't tell if that's plot driven (Sam's slowly changing and Dean starts to finally question what Zeke's motivations are) or is just bad writing. I'm tempted to think the latter purely because of those writers.

And what they hell is with the rogue reapers? (Oh that's right - use them when you can't think of what else to use). Why no just use another angel anyway (did I miss something there?).

Watching Dean and Sam torture someone is not cool (I know they are tough hunters but it's still hard to watch). And wasn't he a reaper? (so not a human vessel?) So reaper's can be killed with an angel blade? Which means they are no different to angels. *head scratch*

This might be an episode I will look back on and it will make more sense. Maybe I was just a bit grumpy after the Clarence moment. It might not be as annoying as I first believed it was. I accept that not all episodes can focus on Sam and Dean - or have interesting MoTW. The douchy angels are just not that interesting to me (Bart reminded of Brady and I wasn't fond of him either). This ep is part of the myth arc so maybe they're just setting up stuff for future eps. *nods* I'll go with that.

Grump grump!! I'm so sorry. I think I'm just needing a good old fashioned MoTW episode. :))

Comments

[jessm78.livejournal.com]

Honestly I'm glad to know that I'm not the only one who felt this way about the episode. And I'm with you, as soon as I saw those two names pop up as the writers I didn't place much faith in it.

The thing that bugged me MORE THAN ANYTHING was Dean not knowing "It's a Wonderful Life".

That really bugged me too! After all the movie references coming from him, and after all the times Meg has called Castiel "Clarence" (and Dean never had a "WTF??" look on his face whenever she did, as far as I can remember anyway), you'd think he'd be at least somewhat familiar with it.

The thing with Sam not experiencing any after effects when Zeke took over really puzzled me, too. I almost thought he'd feel like he'd blacked out or something for a second. Though I do like Jared's Zeke as well.

Agree on everything else pretty much, especially the douchy angels... and Bart reminded me of Brady too.

This ep was a real letdown for me. Hoping the next one will be better.

[el1ie.livejournal.com]

I'm kind of pleased there aren't many women on this show if this is how these writers think we act - UGH!

But on that note, wasn't April a reaper and not an angel? Isn't that why Zeke found them? No, don't mention Taxi Driver and the whole new aspect of Reapers, I'll be over here scratching my head...

Rest of it, I'm too sqeaked out over to have much to add.

[killabeez.livejournal.com]

Agree so hard on all counts, but especially "It's a Wonderful Life." You cannot tell me that the wee!Dean and wee!Sam of "A Very Supernatural Christmas," left alone for Christmas in a crappy motel as they probably were more than once, had ANYTHING ELSE TO WATCH on TV. They must have seen that movie approximately 5,000 times.

It's ridiculous. I know it's hard to find time to watch 8 seasons of previous canon when you're a TV writer, but it's your job. (Though why, with these two, I have no idea.) Feel free to skip over racist truck episodes (O WAIT HAHA) but for fuck's sake, watch the important ones. Or, you know, ANY OF THEM.

*headdesk*

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Oh!!! Was she a reaper?! Oh...dammit...I knew I must have missed something (I tuned out with all the evil angel chat). Ok - the whole rouge reaper thing doesn't make sense to me, but at least she wasn't a vessel.

And yeah - squeaked is how I felt too and I actually don't squirm too easily. Dean allowing this to happen to Sam (and seeming so comfortable with it) is beginning to worry me now.

[counteragent.livejournal.com]

I totally agree with you on all counts!

I actually had the idea that maybe Zeke was making htem BOTH dumb, haha. It's the only way I could explain this crapfest.

[counteragent.livejournal.com]

That note was so sour to me, too. Dean SPEAKS IN MOVIE QUOTES.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Yes - there is no way Dean wouldn't know who Clarence was. I know the actors have to just say their lines, but I'm surprised the Js didn't pull them up on that one.

I liked the way jared went in and out of Sam and Zeke - as though absolutely nothing happened, but I hope they don't let that go on for too long Sam being used and Dean being ok with it is going to be very hard to take very very soon.

I'm not so much angry with this ep as non plussed and worried. I'm hoping it's a writing (and directing) problem and not the direction the show is heading in.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Both of those boys would know It's a Wonderful Life inside out! In fact, I'd be surprised if Dean hasn't actually quoted that movie at some point over the last 8 years.

I'm actually surprised the Js didn't pull them up on that. I know, as actors, their job is to just act, but they know these characters so damn well I'm surprised they wouldn't have say something (or Carver or Thompson). I have no idea why they thought the audience needed to know that anyway (the only reason I can think they had those lines there). Meg had been calling him Clarence without the need for them to tell us the reference.

Urgh. These writers. /o\

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Yes! Zeke has magical dumb making powers. That explains it - his aim is to neutralise the Winchesters by taking away their ability to think.

[el1ie.livejournal.com]

Well, don't quote me on it because at the time I was raging about yet another woman picking up a stray on the street and taking him home...(*cough* - Daphne) but yeah, I think she was a reaper. The big question though is - do the rogue reapers have their own bodies and why? Because, if not, and I don't see why they would need a body, then your whole statement still stands, that girl was possessed and used in the most heinous ways without the blinking of an eye, the reasons to me being writing by rote of fan wishes and it still squicks me.

The whole thing with Sam now is skeevy too, Dean's actually USING Zeke. Yeah, I know, it will come to something, but how far it will go and if there will be rational repercussions is the worrying part. Do they KNOW what they're doing to these characters? Dean shoving Zeke in Sam was in character and maybe using any means possible to find a friend may also be in character. But if these things are addressed as being wrong, just shoved in for the sake of a huge blow out without pointing out all the nuanced fall out, then I'm not sure why they're doing it.

[ayane42.livejournal.com]

i liked this episode. it was like an 8 not a 10 like last week.

dean hasn't seen "it's a wonderful life". made in 1946, i've seen it once. my daughter, born in 1986 has never seen it. and we don't live a hunter's life. i can see sam sitting with jess in his dorm room watching this with her. what was dean doing during christmas with and without sam? there's plenty of "classic" movies i haven't seen, 'gone with the wind', 'citizen kane', 'the maltese falcon', 'casablanca'.

what i loved about this episode was dean and how he is digging himself into a deeper hole. he is going to be sooo fucked when sam finds out. man. and i can see it in his face. he's between a rock and a hard place. tell sam, he ejects zeke, he dies. now zeke is concerned about cas being there and he is worried so cas has to go. so dean has to get rid of cas. how is he going to explain that to sam.

and yeah, this is what, the 3rd episode, so i was rooting for zeke, he's a good angel, cas vouched for him, but now, i don't know. i mean, zeke did save cas. used that angel juice he probably didn't have to spare. for the angel nuke to get rid of the demons, now the juice to heal cas. man, i don't know. mixed signals.

just a mess. guh. dean, fuck, i feel for him.

[katsheswims.livejournal.com]

I think there was some kind of error in the episode about April. She clearly said some things to Cas about how April was a nice girl and she was acting like her to get to Castiel etc. implying she was an angel. And she seemed really invested in Metatron and Heaven (not like it was just business) But then later Dean says she was a reaper. I suppose perhaps Dean just didn't realize? (Though I don't remember seeing black wings marks when she died...did we even see the body? I don't think so.)

[ash48.livejournal.com]

I haven't kicked up a stink about what Dean's done up until now because I felt (after last week's ep) that they were really going to be addressing it and it was going to be interesting. But if this is what we are going to get - Sam having these powers without any repercussions I will be kicking up one god almighty stink.

Tessa was a reaper and, if I remember correctly, Dean saw what he wanted to see. A version that he was comfortable with (though I can't remember if she chose the "look" or Dean saw her that way). I have to assume they don't need human vessels (which explains why they used reapers rather than angels - to not have Cas have sex with a vessel. At least they had considered that!).

[growyourwings.livejournal.com]

Yes I watched the episode last night.

This morning when I opened my LJ feed and saw episode posts (a few only), I l thought, "oh yeah, there was an episode on last night. I forgot."

You always do such a good job reading my mind and then doing my posts for me (lol), so much all of this that you've said.

I remember kinda going, "huh?" when Dean didn't *get* the Clarence reference. Really?

I admit to a few eyerolls at the shirtless Cas scenes. And at the April/Cas scene. The whole April thing is just weird. Angel/reaper/whatever. And I *really* do NOT get the concept of rogue reapers at all.

And yes, angels are more demony every day. Bart reminded me more of a Leviathan than an angel. Shades of Dick.

I loved the scene in the alley and Cas's line about wasted food. And yes, I also heard Misha in that. In fact, I was having a bit of difficulty separating Misha from Cas in a few scenes. I think the loss of the trenchcoat is confusing me.

On a different note, Jared truly rocks playing Zeke. I really can see the difference.

[katsheswims.livejournal.com]

Yeah, this episode wasn't a great one for me either.

I do find Dean's actions regarding telling Cas he can't stay believable. Zeke was basically threatening Sam and when Dean has to chose anything over Sam then Sam comes first. For all Dean knows if Zeke left just then Sam would die. (Though like you said how would he know when Sam was okay again? He has to trust Zeke's word. Dean was desperate when he made that deal with Zeke, but hopefully he'll start thinking of back ups plans/contingencies soon!)

I don't know if Zeke is purposefully isolating Dean and sending away someone who could possibly realize he's in Sam, or if he was honest about why he wanted Cas gone. Either way he's getting more and more sketchy--probably will end up a bad guy. (But who knows they might surprise us still?)

I loved your thoughts about Dean seeing Cas more like a son (or a little brother) great! I can totally see that.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I can sort of buy your point about Dean and It's a Wonderful Life, but it's such a classic movie and Dean watches A LOT of television - it seems crazy that he wouldn't know that reference. But...I can try and accept he's a modern movie man and not a classic one (which means of course I'll have to go and check all of Dean's quote to see that he's never quoted the classics...).

Dean is certainly digging himself a deeper hole. Oh my god - sooo deep. I just felt we didn't see that Dean was having an issue with that. I like the idea of it spiralling out of his control (in fact..yes! that would work for me -a lie leads to another lie etc) but I would love to have seen Dean getting really uncomfortable with that. Last week he couldn't look Zeke in the eye - now he's demanding he come out of Sam without being in the least bit freaked by that.

I really hope this is followed up next week with Sam questioning Dean if Dean ends up kicking Cas out. Sam should see no reason for Dean to do that. I would like to have seen Dean wrestle a little more with kicking out Cas -especially when he knows the danger that's out there for him.

Zeke is dodgy. Part of the mystery is his end game - which I'm excited to see revealed.

But yeah. Not a favourite - but maybe it will grown on me. ;)

[ash48.livejournal.com]

I thought she was an angel to start with. I'll have to watch those moments again to see what's said exactly. I think she'd definitely have to be a reaper to get away with the non con sex. I know they keep pushing the non con issue, but this would be taking it to the extremes.

[killabeez.livejournal.com]

Way to suck all the charm out of a reference, guys. Meg calling him that was perfect, and I grinned like crazy when they revealed Cas was using that name. Then it was like... oh. Way to ruin it by overexplaining.

Maybe the reason that was in the scene is that they needed Sam to be saying something so that when he turned into Zeke, there would be a contrast. And obviously, they could not think of anything actually interesting or relevant for Sam to say.

[bowtrunckle.livejournal.com]

When I saw who wrote this episode my expectations plummeted, and I sort of unplugged and didn't think too much about what was happening or why (maybe it was a self preservation tactic). ;) Maybe it's just a coincidence (probably) but they seem to get the rogue reapers popping out of their recent scripts, so they're now the "reapers [of convenience] writers" in my head. Hehe, reaper writers.

You bring up a lot of good points, esp. about the abuse/murder of vessels. I feel like Show has become very detached from its original stance on human collateral damage and the "saving people" portion of its tag line in lieu of "hunting things" and the idea of doing *anything* to get the job done not only in terms of vessels, but meat suits, AND innocent victims of the week/non-possessed humans. Perhaps it's just a gradual desensitization of Sam and Dean's feelings, the writers, and/or the audiences' expectations. But regardless, I feel like it now getting so blatant it's hard to pass off or overlook, esp. when main characters are involved and seemingly unaffected by it. We expect more from them, mostly bec. we've seen it in the past. Instead it seems like Dean's myopia regarding Sam is becoming more a driving force than just an Achilles's heel and that's what the writers are using as sole motivation for his behavior, which is so ironic considering that it's Sam that Dean's "abusing". Maybe these specific issues can be attributed to the writing team for this episode, but I feel like it's a definite trend, one that falls on the shoulders of the show runners and all of the writers. I still love that Gamble was the one side step the consent issues with Ruby by championing for an vessel empty. And I think we need more of that kind of conscientious voice on behalf of the all the characters in the writers' room.

I felt SO BAD for Cas this episode (a first for me). His gratitude and almost gleefulness as being in the bunker was so heartbreaking and then Dean kicks him out. :( Surprisingly, I'm finding myself interested in Cas this season!

[el1ie.livejournal.com]

Reapers - you're right, I'm sure Tessa said they appeared in any form and were ruled by the person they appeared to. Canon - I kind of think of it in two dimensions, pre-Caver and post-Carver, with Taxi Driver driven like a nail through the coffin.

I have NO idea and not much incentive to watch it again to find out.

[tebtosca.livejournal.com]

She mentioned the real April, so she was a reaper possessing a vessel. Which makes no sense of course, but lolcanon

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Oh yes yes she did...dammit. I was liking the idea that no vessel was involved....;(

lolcanon indeed...

[bowtrunckle.livejournal.com]

Sorry to jump in, but I wanted to add that I feel like this team of writers used contrasting tone to deliberately play up Sam-Zeke transitions (and the differences between Sam and Zeke in general ... Sam felt weirdly, overly happy) and "fake out" the audience. We also saw this in the scene where Sam and Dean were joking/bickering about pie, seemingly distracted only to jump the rogue reaper in the alley.

[killabeez.livejournal.com]

Agreed, and it's kind of a trap that workmanlike writers, or writers who are rushing, fall into. I recognize it. *coff*

The alley scene was actually one of my favorite things in this ep, because it was such a direct callback to the Gordon episode from S3. Plus, I love Sam and Dean working together and effectively. ♥

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Oooh yes. It reminded me of the Gordon scene also. Even though I knew that's exactly what they were setting up, I liked it. And YAY an actual moment where they were working together and being clever.