11.23 reaction/review
May. 27th, 2016 10:59 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
ash48It seems I am surprisingly chill about this episode (I know! Knock me over with a feather). In fact, I even have some nice things to say about it. :)
I was all prepared to write "this will be my last ever reaction post and I'm done with the whole thing" (well, not the last bit. I'll never be done with it, but I really thought it was going to signal the end of me being an active fan).
But it looks like that's not the case. Damn you Show!! (But also YAY because I don't like being utterly pissed at you).
Ok. So let me get this off my chest first. The mytharc this season was batshit crazy. And Big. It was incredibly ambitious and even though I admire them for that ambition, I feel it was ultimately bigger than they could handle. But they tried and maybe I should give them kudos for that.
I'm not going to dwell on the negative in this review. If you've read any of my past reaction posts you'll know what's annoyed me.
Though I will say I was shaking my head A LOT during the episode. Especially Rowena's ability to do just about anything. And Dean's vessel being able to hold that many souls. And Sam not having some important reaction shots when they were needed. There's just so much to hand wave that I'm really just not going to bother (let alone why the hell Lucifer was let out of the cage in the first place and then Dean THANKING Cas for it. Yeah - probably best not to dwell on that too much either grrrrrr).
I'm also reluctant to read too much into it all. I am convinced They don't so I'm not too keen to get myself twisted up looking for deeper meanings.
Though there were some things that worked for me:
1. Breaking the mould.
I watch the show for the brothers and their crazy, die-for each other relationship. But I will openly confess I'm not always happy that they end seasons with them being prepared to destroy the world for each other. Ok. I know that's appealing in the greater scheme of their amazing bond, but I have been desperate to see them acknowledge that there will be a time when a death sacrifice will have to be made for the "good" of the world rather than destroy it (or worse, destroy the other). This episode felt like it delivered for me on this.
I suspect this episode was to be a kind of companion to Swan Song. Instead of Sam sacrificing himself, it was Dean. And in many ways it did work like that. Only, the writing wasn't nearly as strong and we didn't get Sam by Dean's side as he went off to die.
I accept that no one could go with Dean (for what ever story telling and "dramatic" ending purposes it had), but it is hard to accept that Sam wasn't allowed to at least protest a little bit.
That said though, I TOTALLY felt Sam's pain at the thought of losing his brother. I felt this 100x more than I did when Dean died in S9 (probably because I was very bitter by the end of S9). I also actually believed that words weren't said because there was literally nothing Sam could say. When Cas suggested Dean could take the "bomb" to Amara there was an inevitability in Sam's face that just said "this is going to happen and no matter what I say it won't change a thing". I also believed that Sam knew it was the best solution and protesting would only make it harder for Dean to go. Sam has been there - been the one to offer himself as a sacrifice. He knew that if he broke down Dean might not go. And, for once, this was a sacrifice for the great good of the world. Not for each other. And I know many fans hate that, but I was actually relieved to see them take a different route. At no point did I think Sam was uncaring for Dean's fate. No did I doubt Sam's utter love for him. It was much more moving to me than platitudes (like "I'm proud of us").
I also felt both Sam and Dean had grown up (don't hit me!). The end matched the statement Sam made in the beginning - we have to do the "saving people" part as well as the hunting things. And they did. It hurt, but it was the right thing to do (stop hitting me!). I was satisfied with it - for reasons that I have been finding hard to explain elsewhere. Let's just say I was moved and therefore it worked for me.
2. The Amara/God arc concluded.
Thank goodness! I was so worried they were going to keep this open (I was convinced Dean would go off into the empty with Amara), so it was with utter relief that they resolved it in a way that puts it completely to bed (well, until they decide to bring the characters back). And I actually liked the way it concluded (I hear you - who are you and what have you done with Ash!). I liked that Dean was a diplomat and it was resolved peacefully. Again, it broke the mould and actually tied up the entire myth arc. This doesn't excuse it for being ridiculous, but at least it die tie it up.
And all I thought at the end, when I saw Amara and God intertwined souls going upward was that it represented Sam and Dean. The whole arc was one big love fest for showing how entwined Sam and Dean are. I'll even go so far as they are a mix of light (Dean) and dark (Sam). Ok, I went too far - but it's my head canon now. ;)
3. Sam and Dean hunting ghosts together.
The scene was pretty useless really, but it was there to remind us of the "hunting things" part of the bumper sticker. I loved the location too!
4. Sam being the one to snap everyone out of their "we can't do anything" stupor.
Ok, Sam was pretty much sidelined at the end (surprise!), but at least he played a part in the beginning. They really had no idea what direction to take Sam by the end of the season, but at least he came across as competent and willing to fight for the world. That's a Sam I recognise.
5. Dean doing Rowena's accent (and the Js enjoying that).
6. The most epic bro-hug of the series (well, maybe second to the one in Lazarus Rising).
It's extremely hard to convince us that either one of them is ever really in danger of death. So all we have is seeing how they react when they think one of them dying or dead. It's what made Red Meat so amazing. I felt Sam's devastation. The hug was so damn heartfelt.
And that's about it really. Much of the rest irked me, but the things that I liked worked enough to save the finale for me. I felt the bro love ooze of the screen and as that's what I'm here for I was at least happy with that.
As for the ending. Purely cliff hanger material. Toni (?) was introduced as a set up for next season and Mary was there to provide the shock. I'm not reading too much into it all. I'm certainly not judging the new character until I've seen more. As for Mary? Who knows. I am tired of all the returning characters, but I'll see what they do. I keep thinking "nothing can be as bad as previous arcs" but that just tempts fate so I won't say that!
Instead I'll reflect back on the great stand-alones we had this season. Aside from the previous 3 eps (and them completely ignoring Sam's Lucifer trauma and, er Casifer - which ended up being for completely nothing it seems), this has been my fave Carver era season. So there is that. :)
Happy for the hiatus now. Hoping my vid muse will eventually kick in and I can finish the two vids I've been trying to finish.
*hugs* We made it!
I was all prepared to write "this will be my last ever reaction post and I'm done with the whole thing" (well, not the last bit. I'll never be done with it, but I really thought it was going to signal the end of me being an active fan).
But it looks like that's not the case. Damn you Show!! (But also YAY because I don't like being utterly pissed at you).
Ok. So let me get this off my chest first. The mytharc this season was batshit crazy. And Big. It was incredibly ambitious and even though I admire them for that ambition, I feel it was ultimately bigger than they could handle. But they tried and maybe I should give them kudos for that.
I'm not going to dwell on the negative in this review. If you've read any of my past reaction posts you'll know what's annoyed me.
Though I will say I was shaking my head A LOT during the episode. Especially Rowena's ability to do just about anything. And Dean's vessel being able to hold that many souls. And Sam not having some important reaction shots when they were needed. There's just so much to hand wave that I'm really just not going to bother (let alone why the hell Lucifer was let out of the cage in the first place and then Dean THANKING Cas for it. Yeah - probably best not to dwell on that too much either grrrrrr).
I'm also reluctant to read too much into it all. I am convinced They don't so I'm not too keen to get myself twisted up looking for deeper meanings.
Though there were some things that worked for me:
1. Breaking the mould.
I watch the show for the brothers and their crazy, die-for each other relationship. But I will openly confess I'm not always happy that they end seasons with them being prepared to destroy the world for each other. Ok. I know that's appealing in the greater scheme of their amazing bond, but I have been desperate to see them acknowledge that there will be a time when a death sacrifice will have to be made for the "good" of the world rather than destroy it (or worse, destroy the other). This episode felt like it delivered for me on this.
I suspect this episode was to be a kind of companion to Swan Song. Instead of Sam sacrificing himself, it was Dean. And in many ways it did work like that. Only, the writing wasn't nearly as strong and we didn't get Sam by Dean's side as he went off to die.
I accept that no one could go with Dean (for what ever story telling and "dramatic" ending purposes it had), but it is hard to accept that Sam wasn't allowed to at least protest a little bit.
That said though, I TOTALLY felt Sam's pain at the thought of losing his brother. I felt this 100x more than I did when Dean died in S9 (probably because I was very bitter by the end of S9). I also actually believed that words weren't said because there was literally nothing Sam could say. When Cas suggested Dean could take the "bomb" to Amara there was an inevitability in Sam's face that just said "this is going to happen and no matter what I say it won't change a thing". I also believed that Sam knew it was the best solution and protesting would only make it harder for Dean to go. Sam has been there - been the one to offer himself as a sacrifice. He knew that if he broke down Dean might not go. And, for once, this was a sacrifice for the great good of the world. Not for each other. And I know many fans hate that, but I was actually relieved to see them take a different route. At no point did I think Sam was uncaring for Dean's fate. No did I doubt Sam's utter love for him. It was much more moving to me than platitudes (like "I'm proud of us").
I also felt both Sam and Dean had grown up (don't hit me!). The end matched the statement Sam made in the beginning - we have to do the "saving people" part as well as the hunting things. And they did. It hurt, but it was the right thing to do (stop hitting me!). I was satisfied with it - for reasons that I have been finding hard to explain elsewhere. Let's just say I was moved and therefore it worked for me.
2. The Amara/God arc concluded.
Thank goodness! I was so worried they were going to keep this open (I was convinced Dean would go off into the empty with Amara), so it was with utter relief that they resolved it in a way that puts it completely to bed (well, until they decide to bring the characters back). And I actually liked the way it concluded (I hear you - who are you and what have you done with Ash!). I liked that Dean was a diplomat and it was resolved peacefully. Again, it broke the mould and actually tied up the entire myth arc. This doesn't excuse it for being ridiculous, but at least it die tie it up.
And all I thought at the end, when I saw Amara and God intertwined souls going upward was that it represented Sam and Dean. The whole arc was one big love fest for showing how entwined Sam and Dean are. I'll even go so far as they are a mix of light (Dean) and dark (Sam). Ok, I went too far - but it's my head canon now. ;)
3. Sam and Dean hunting ghosts together.
The scene was pretty useless really, but it was there to remind us of the "hunting things" part of the bumper sticker. I loved the location too!
4. Sam being the one to snap everyone out of their "we can't do anything" stupor.
Ok, Sam was pretty much sidelined at the end (surprise!), but at least he played a part in the beginning. They really had no idea what direction to take Sam by the end of the season, but at least he came across as competent and willing to fight for the world. That's a Sam I recognise.
5. Dean doing Rowena's accent (and the Js enjoying that).
6. The most epic bro-hug of the series (well, maybe second to the one in Lazarus Rising).
It's extremely hard to convince us that either one of them is ever really in danger of death. So all we have is seeing how they react when they think one of them dying or dead. It's what made Red Meat so amazing. I felt Sam's devastation. The hug was so damn heartfelt.
And that's about it really. Much of the rest irked me, but the things that I liked worked enough to save the finale for me. I felt the bro love ooze of the screen and as that's what I'm here for I was at least happy with that.
As for the ending. Purely cliff hanger material. Toni (?) was introduced as a set up for next season and Mary was there to provide the shock. I'm not reading too much into it all. I'm certainly not judging the new character until I've seen more. As for Mary? Who knows. I am tired of all the returning characters, but I'll see what they do. I keep thinking "nothing can be as bad as previous arcs" but that just tempts fate so I won't say that!
Instead I'll reflect back on the great stand-alones we had this season. Aside from the previous 3 eps (and them completely ignoring Sam's Lucifer trauma and, er Casifer - which ended up being for completely nothing it seems), this has been my fave Carver era season. So there is that. :)
Happy for the hiatus now. Hoping my vid muse will eventually kick in and I can finish the two vids I've been trying to finish.
*hugs* We made it!
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 03:29 am (UTC)I'd say I'm glad I'm not the only one who saw that, but it's not like I was going to miss it (rolls eyes toward my stock icon). I don't think it's a simple case of Dean=light Sam=dark (or vice versa) though. The important thing about the yin and the yang is that when they're pushed to their extreme they become the other. Back when the show knew what it was doing it showed them alternating in those roles. If one thing gives me hope it's that Dabb has at least shown he understands some of these things. Whether he can execute them well . . . well, we'll see . . .
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 03:34 am (UTC)Ah, but did you notice the accent Dean did was actually Welsh, not Scottish? That joke must have been for the benefit of British fans. I can't imagine many of the American viewers will pick up on it.
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 03:36 am (UTC)"So there were some scenes that were written, that were ultimately cut. And some of those scenes involved Chuck telling Sam why he should no longer be afraid of Lucifer while he's around...I know Sam. Sam is terrified of Lucifer. He's been Lucifer, he's been ruined by Lucifer, he's been in the cage in Hell, the box in Hell, because of Lucifer. He doesn't want anything to do with him. So Sam doesn't feel comfortable. And there were a lot of choices I made as an actor that...I'm sort of sad they didn't show up on screen. But I understand that we only have a certain amount of time."
-----
As far as the finale, I think you said it very well here:
It's extremely hard to convince us that either one of them is ever really in danger of death. So all we have is seeing how they react when they think one of them dying or dead. It's what made Red Meat so amazing. I felt Sam's devastation. The hug was so damn heartfelt.
And here:
When Cas suggested Dean could take the "bomb" to Amara there was an inevitability in Sam's face that just said "this is going to happen and no matter what I say it won't change a thing". I also believed that Sam knew it was the best solution and protesting would only make it harder for Dean to go. Sam has been there - been the one to offer himself as a sacrifice. He knew that if he broke down Dean might not go.
That's what sold the episode, plus Dean's humanity being what stopped the end of the world.
I like where we will be starting season 12, with Sam thinking Dean is dead and Dean, once he recovers from the shock of seeing Mary, about to find Sam is MIA.
I do hope they do something worthy of Mary's character returning, though!
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 03:51 am (UTC)Amen.
I really, really wanted to slap/kick/stab Dean for thanking Castiel for bringing Lucifer topside. I don't get it! UGH! I honestly think the only reason for Lucifer was to give Misha/Castiel something to do.
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 04:55 am (UTC)I agree. It wasn't right that Sam let Dean go off to die alone. Especially without so much as a protest. That wasn't an aspect I liked.
It's been a fun decade and we'll always have those years when we could mock Carver
It's certainly had it's moments. I probably needed to get into the mocking Carver more because I will always be left with bitter resentment of what he's done to Sam and Dean during his time. And I'm hoping not to quit the show in better resentment. I know I'm in for the long haul so I simply have to find ways of coping. And there's still so much for me to love.
Now finish reading Captive Prince so we can have something fannish to talk about again!
I'm getting there!! I LOVE it so much! I have the other two books now. Now show is over I will be able to concentrate on reading again. :))
*hugs* See you around in another fannish life. <3
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 04:58 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 04:59 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 05:03 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 05:25 am (UTC)Yeah, I had seen that quote from Jared. It made me very angry. And sad. They made choices to show some trivial stuff in that episode (11.22) and not show crucial character moments - that were so important to understanding why Sam was suddenly ok with Lucifer.
Though, that said, the whole season was a screw up as far as Sam and Lucifer was concerned. As soon as he was in Cas, Lucifer become different character. It was pretty unforgivable for me.
I like where we will be starting season 12, with Sam thinking Dean is dead and Dean, once he recovers from the shock of seeing Mary, about to find Sam is MIA.
Yes. At least we know for sure that Sam thinks Dean is dead. Not like in S8 were we just had to assume he thought that. I'm intrigued for S12 - I think they've put themselves in an interesting position. Hope Dabb and Singer have a good handle on it all.
I do hope they do something worthy of Mary's character returning, though!
Yeah. That would be my only worry. So far, I haven't been thrilled with the returning characters. Lucifer totally changed, and Chuck..well, don't get me started on that. I'm actually hoping she's not returned from the dead (I think). But I'm not really sure what I'd hope for (maybe for Sam to be able to finally meet her?)
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 05:28 am (UTC)I'm glad they're shot of it too. I won't be surprised if Lucifer is forgotten about next season. Much like Death's death never meant anything after the end of last season.
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 07:09 am (UTC)Sam was blamed for the Darkness yet never had a literal scene with Amara outside of teen Amara throwing him out the door it was all ridiculous and why was she bonded to Dean?. She would of been no more bonded to him than anyone else but that is me.
Sam,s faith went no where outside of giving God a glass of water and then some british women turns up out of the blue and shoots him. I mean who would want to be Sam in the world these writers have created.
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 07:27 am (UTC)I still love him though and is pretty much the main reason I'm still here (and SamnDean of course). Someone has to love him because the writers don't seem to.
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 07:39 am (UTC)Such a wonderful show, so unique, reduced to well, nothing!
Sitting around guzzling beer while Dean is off on a suicide mission. How is that even possible?
Remember Sam's anguish when Lilith was coming for Dean in season 3. Sam would never have hung around drinking, I don't care how mature he's become.
Then Castiel who is forgiven for every idiotic and evil thing he's done. It's just not right.
No-one mentions it any more, but among the more outstanding things, he also killed his best friends Balthazar and Rebecca just because they didn't agree with his plans.
What good has he ever done for the Winchesters other than cure then of the occasional wound?
While poor Sam gets blamed for everything.
It makes me want to yell at the screen sometimes.
Apart from that, what about the poor souls. If Dean had exploded would those souls have been destroyed? Who gives them the right o fiddle with human souls? That annoyed me too.
The English interlude was so cheesy, so clichèd that it was cringe-worthy.
You've probably understood by now that I found nothing positive in this episode except for the brother hug, which are always my favourite moments, but a show cannot live by hugs alone.
Sorry for being so negative. I don't have your sweetness of soul.:)
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 07:49 am (UTC)Next season Sam and Dean open a Supernatural Psychological Counselling shop. A sign on the door reads:
"Please pop into the bunker at any time. We are always open. Anyone is welcome. We counsel both light and dark beings and specialize in sibling rivalry. We are very proud of successfully helping God and his Sister as our most prominent clients. Our motto: When all is lost we talk.
Please no smiting, shooting, punching, hexing or stabbing inside the bunker. Thank you."
Can next season be only MotW episodes, please?
xx
(Excuse the repeated edits. Brain is malfunctioning.)
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 08:15 am (UTC)And Sam would never sit around drinking while Dean was off ready to kill himself. Much like Sam would never not look for Dean when he suddenly disappeared after S7. We have seen the lengths Sam would go to save Dean and I keep remembering those.
I tweeted that Red Meat was my finale. That had the intensity and brother focus that I want from a finale. These days there's just far too many characters so by the end they have too many loose ends to tie up.
I am still confused why I wasn't full of despair after this episode. Perhaps I should have been (and some of me is). But I think I've run out of caring what they actually do now? I've been shattered too many times I'm kinda numb with it all (and I was expecting it to be a whole lot worse I have admit).
*hugs* Time for a nice break from the show. I'm going to be taking some time off I think. Just leave it all aside for a while.
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 08:18 am (UTC)And yeah, Sam and Dean as counsellors. To God and his sister no less!
It all does my head in. Which is why I've stopped trying to think too hard about it any more. The show has changed so much. I'm still here for the boys. As longs as there are still MoTW eps I will be ok. If the arc sucks next season I might just have to skip them. I have no idea what Dabb will be like as show runner. The fact that he wrote Bloodlines and thought it was a good spin off has be worried.
But we'll see! In the meantime I'm looking forward to having a break from it all. :)
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 08:34 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 10:45 am (UTC)I too liked how they tied up Amara and Chuck, it felt in line with our Shows core of family. And Dean being the spokesman of humanity just worked me for. This ep did feel a little flat in places, but there were plenty of beautifully shot scenes, and I'm all for a big bro hug!
Overall this was a strong season for me, so many wonderful episodes all in a row, and now I'm looking forward to a summer full of theories, ideas, fic and art about what we saw in the last few minutes!!! (Did Toni miss? Did Sam get zapped away in the nick of time? Is Mary back temporarily or for good? Will we see John too? Where is Lucifer?)
I'm so happy that you found some enjoyment in the finale. Thank you for sticking this through until the end, I know you struggled, but I'd hate to lose you here. Take care *hugs*
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 10:49 am (UTC)For one, I'm thrilled that they finally brought back a female character from the dead!
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 11:18 am (UTC)Thanks hun (I kinda needed to hear that right now <3).
And I'm looking forward to hearing all the theories! We know Sam's not dead so what could have happened?! I'd like to think that maybe, as a last gesture, God saved him. I doubt that happened but I would love God to do something for Sam. He's ignored him for so long so it would be a nice gesture (and maybe enough for Toni to realise that Sam is more important just the MoL stuff and get on side with the Winchester - which I also hope happens. I seriously doubt I could cope with a new female big bad). Oh damn it! I now have hopes!
And with Lucifer potentially being about we still might have some resolution for Sam on this too!
Eek. I don't want hopes. They get dashed to often.
Thanks again hun.
xx
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 11:22 am (UTC)omg. I thought I might have been the only one. If Sam had gscrewed things up because he couldn't let Dean die I would have been more frustrated. Not to say he shouldn't been allowed to offer to go with Dean, but I just felt there were some important steps taken here.
For one, I'm thrilled that they finally brought back a female character from the dead!
Always great to see Mary! I'm going to ignore my feelings of what's going to happen next….
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 11:56 am (UTC)Popped back for this.
I was under the impression (or thought) that the souls would be released from the veil and into heaven (or hell). They just needed their energy and light to kill Amara. Billie wanted to reap them and send them on their way. Maybe? I'd have to watch that again to make sure...
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 12:04 pm (UTC)But wouldn't their energy be extinguished if the souls exploded like a bomb? Or are human souls truly indestructible?
As you say, one would have to check up on that, I can't remember if it's dealt with in the ep.
no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 12:08 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-05-27 12:16 pm (UTC)However logic dictates that if that were the case, demon souls should be indestructible too as they are still human souls, but warped.
In fact, back in season six, Crowley was supplying hell souls to Castiel so he could stand off against Raphael so, yeah..... I got nothin'. lol.