10.09 Poll

[ash48]

After posting my initial reaction earlier I couldn't resist the poll because I'm curious what you all thought. A more detailed review to follow when I can gather my thoughts.

[Poll #1991771]

Comments

[raloria.livejournal.com]

I understand Dean not wanting to tell Sam what was happening, especially after what he told Cas. Dean doesn't want to put Sam in the position of having to save him or...worst case scenario, kill him. That's why he went to Cas instead and told him to keep Sam out of it "because he'll try". Actually, it's classic big brother Dean trying to protect Sam once again. It'd be endearing if it wasn't so wrong. :P

I still don't like that Sam left Dean alone in the house and it seems I'm not the only one. I wouldn't call Sam a villain though and actually, this whole thing can be resolved if they have Sam lamenting the fact that Dean did that killing and Sam wasn't there to stop him. Because I can totally see Sam blaming himself for this, that he didn't act on his hunches about what was happening with his brother. It's the Winchester way, after all. I actually think Sam feeling guilty about it would redeem his character ('cause we all make mistakes like that in the heat of the moment). But if he doesn't feel guilty about it, that scene will simply remain what it looked like - a dumb, bad decision on Sam's part. However, the writers could have done it differently...time will tell if it was the right way or not. I'll have to wait and see what happens next.

[quickreaver.livejournal.com]

I think we're going to have to disagree on this one.

Likewise, I'm not the only one who didn't find Dean's fibbing endearing, and thought Sam leaving Dean in that room felt like the writers forcing Sam into doing something OOC to facilitate the plot. Again.

The whole thing could also be resolved by Dean admitting he's been de-emphasizing his MoC symptoms to Sam, and if he'd been honest with his brother from the get-go, maybe the slaughter could've been averted.

What's the "Winchester Way?" Not acting on one's hunches about what's happening? I'm not sure I understand you, there. Do you mean them not talking and being honest with each other? Okay, maybe that's true.

If you truly believe Sam's character needs to be redeemed by admitting his guilt and culpability in Dean's killing frenzy? I'm...wow. I just don't know about that. Holding Sam accountable for that, when Dean willingly took the Mark and has continued to hide things from Sam is pretty unfair, IMHO.

But knowing this bunch of writers, it'll never be addressed. We'll probably never know. Heck, there could've been lines that wound up on the cutting room floor that would've shed light on the whole shebang; we know this has happened before!

Ah, well.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

I actually think Sam feeling guilty about it would redeem his character ('cause we all make mistakes like that in the heat of the moment).

Oooh, I have to wonder what on earth Sam has to redeem here? It didn't even cross my mind that Sam did the slightest thing wrong (and thank goodness Guy Bee confirmed that Sam thought Dean was behind him and it wasn't until he got to the car that he realised (too late) that he was still inside). It means the reason Sam was part from Dean was purely narrative. Dean needed to kill without Sam around so this was the way it was done. Clunky for sure - and definitely nothing to do with Sam. I will fervently argue that Sam made no mistake here. Or rather, this wasn't at all about Sam making a mistake. He might kick himself for believing Dean was in control, but even then he's not THAT dumb (no matter how much they dumb down the characters). We've seen Sam support Dean and even though he knows Dean is lying all he can do is trust him. I just can't see how Dean killing all those (mostly) "innocent" men has anything to do with Sam. Having said that, I accept that some of fandom will most definitely find a way to blame Sam because unfortunately even when Dean is the one lying and killing he'll be taken off the hook.

Yikes! Sorry - the words "Sam" and "redemption" seem to be triggers for rants! I'm still not over people thinking Sam needs to redeem himself from last season. I might be wrong but Sam fully redeemed himself at the end of S5. I think we are now on Dean's journey to redemption. Sam is the support (like Dean was in S4-5) and Dean is turning dark side and after murdering those men (and no doubt more darkness to come) his will be a journey of redemption at some point (I think!).

[raloria.livejournal.com]

I would reply back to all this, but I'm honestly afraid to at this point. I'm not the best at expressing my views and my thoughts tend to do more harm than good, or get misunderstood, so I'm simply going to respectfully bow out. ♥

[ash48.livejournal.com]

I understand. I'm not great at expressing myself either and I know I have offended people recently. I am curious about views that differ from mine, which is why I love having good discussion. I know Sam is often seen as the bad guy and I suppose I'm always interested in that because I know my blinkered view might miss that approach to him. I also know, in terms of the wider fandom, I'm in the minority. Sam has, for so long now, been the brother needing redemption that I think (think! *g*) it's taking a while for anyone accept that Dean might be on that journey now. Of course, I maybe off course- and it might be wishful thinking on my part.

Aaanyway. All good! Discussing stuff from different perspectives can be tricky, but please know that I always appreciate different POVs and actually love that discussion.:)