Jensen interview
Mar. 12th, 2014 06:46 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
ash48Note: There are spoilers in the interview. Under the cut are spoilers for the Mark's affect on Dean only - and minor speculation.
Jensen's kindly given an interview to The Winchester Brothers on Winchester Radio recently (I suggest you avoid the comments in the above link if you want to avoid some nastiness. I accidentally saw some and decided to respond. I KNOW I shouldn't have done but dammit I was steaming). I actually read a transcript of the interview (and I've just seen that![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
stir_of_echoes has created one also <3) rather than listen to it. I started to listen but found it a little…er…messy (which might have been because of nerves maybe).
I thinkmissyjack said it best when she called Jensen the ultimate Dean!girl. :) And so he should be. Listening to him talk about Dean is wonderful and insightful. I love how supportive he is of the character and it has given me some insights to how he goes about playing him. I particularly love how he includes his experiences in Purgatory as something that drives Dean. We never see that (unfortunately!), but it's wonderful that Jensen's using it for inspiration.
It's also interesting to hear his take on Sam. Some of it I found hard to accept and I didn't agree with quite a bit of it, but I did find it interesting. I know that Jensen probably doesn't spent a lot of time analysing Sam's character (if at all), so it's not surprising that his comments are based on Dean's experience of Sam and not how he sees Sam fitting into the overall picture. Which makes sense because as an actor you are totally focused on your own character (I'm hoping Jared will do a similar interview because I'd love to hear his insights into Sam).
I wasn't totally thrilled by the pitch of some of the questions (in fact, it was a little disappointing that the interviewers weren't more objective and even handed with the questions) but there were some great questions that allowed Jensen to really talk about his character.
Some interesting comments he made:
Obviously, Dean is willing to go all-in and keep the family together, and keep the brothers moving down the road and it seems that more and more, Sam is willing to cash out and he’s not willing to put his life on the line the way that Dean is.
Not going to deny that this comment really took me aback. I have no idea what "cash out" means but if this is the Sam we are going to be seeing in the future it might well be the final straw for me. I'm not quite sure what Jensen's take on 8.23 was but Sam was completely ready to put his life on the line for the greater good. And er….end S5? Though I will accept that Jensen might be channeling Dean and thinks that Sam won't lay his life on the line for Dean. Which is crazy of course, but it's something Dean would absolutely be feeling (though if Show decides that actually Sam WON'T lay his life on the line for Dean then it's not the show I originally started watching so it'll be all over red rover for me).
That’s a tough pill for Dean to swallow, and I think the only way he’s dealing with it is by not dealing with it.
That's a really interesting observation and I think that's definitely true. I love that he mentioned this because I've wondered if Dean not acknowledging what Sam has suffered is part of him just not wanting to deal. We've seen Dean shut down more and more I think.
The mark of Cain has given him a simplicity in his thoughts that’s allowing him to ignore the complexity of their relationship right now and focus on the prize, which is Abbadon at this point
Fair call..but…um….Abbadon is the prize? I thought Gadreel was on the top of Dean's list? Not sure exactly how Addadon became top priority. Maybe it's because it's what Crowley wants? I'm trying to remember why Addadon is such a thorn in Dean's side - considering she hasn't really featured much this season (or last for that matter). Curious.
So, I think the line between black and white is becoming almost dangerously clear, the grey areas are becoming less and less as far as Dean is concerned.
Awesome! The Mark is going to be really interesting for Dean. Seeing a cold (almost soulless) Dean is going to give Jensen some great stuff to work with and will be great to watch.
Yeah, for a long time there were a lot of different storylines going on, mostly revolving around Sam, and what the story was doing to Sam although a lot of it, it could be said was being seen through Dean’s perspective, the story was always, kind of about Sam and what was going on internally with him
Pretty much what we all know and have said for a while. Though not sure how "what was going on internally with him" means as we don't get a lot on what's going on with him internally. I mean, we get the angst but we don't get to see the result of all the crap that happens to him. But I get it - from Dean's perspective stuff is ALWAYS happening to Sam (and my god it really is!) and I kinda get the sense that Jensen is happy for the "stuff" is now going to be happening to him.
Which I'm pretty darn excited by too. He also talks about the roles reversing - which makes me wonder if we'll get to watch Dean's story through Sam's eyes now? I think that would be pretty cool if handled right.
Yeah, Sam’s a real selfish asshole is what it boils down to (laughs)
It is true, Sam seems to be a little preoccupied and maybe it’s a little brother thing. Maybe he’s
“You’re my big brother you can figure it out yourself.”
But that’s a contrast to the way Dean thinks as in, “I’m the big brother and I have to protect my little brother from harm.” That’s kind of been his creed for as long as he can remember so I think that they both kind of come at it from different angles. Sam is more willing to allow for things to happen as they happen and it’s a Sam-centric world in his mind, and I think it always has been and I think it’s been a Sam-centric show for a long time
Yeah. I probably should just let this go. I know Jensen said some of this in jest but if even Jensen thinks Sam's an asshole what the hell hope do any of us have that think he's not. *sigh* And Sam is Sam-centric? Yeah, saving the world was all about Sam. Trying to trade himself for Dean in hell was clearly all about Sam. Sam continuing to hunt, save people, listen and help people is only because Sam thinks about himself. Clearly. (I know I am coming across as some sort of bitter Sam!girl, but I seriously must be watching a different show if, after everything, Sam is still considered selfish). I am aware that Jensen is talking about the characters and it makes sense that that is what Dean would be thinking - but even then Dean KNOWS Sam is not selfish - he's seen first hand the things Sam has been willing to do for others. I suppose it's fair that Jensen might think that though - considering a lot of fandom thinks the same.
What does come across clearly is Jensen wanting something more for his character. And I don't blame him. When we look back and think about everything that has happened to Sam it's pretty epic. Jared has been able to play all sorts of characters - many different versions of Sam. Jensen hasn't really had that opportunity, so I think Jensen has a right to be feeling pretty over Jared getting all the cool stuff. Jensen plays "dark" very well (end!verse Dean is still one of my fav Deans) and I think the Mark is going to give him some great material to work with. Oooh, we still might get to see 2014!Dean emerge. That would be wicked if they somehow gave us that future version of Dean - what a cool tie in.
Whether he protects him because of the fear of loneliness, whatever the reason is, I don’t think Dean sits in his bed and psychoanalyses himself all that much.
Definitely. And interestingly it's coming across exactly like that. WE do! But Dean doesn't. Even non-Mark Dean wouldn't contemplate his motivations too much. He just is.
Winchester Radio: To that end, are there any decisions that Dean has made over the years that you could revisit and possibly alter in some way?
What would be the issue if you were to do so?
Jensen: Not invite Gadreel into Sam. That would be number one on the list.
*phew* I'm glad we're on the same page about that. And he, like me, understands that what Dean did is all part of the story telling. This isn't Jensen saying he didn't what that for Dean, but rather knowing that Dean would want do-over on that one decision.
I have to say this interview hasn't given me a lot of hope for the storyline exploring Sam being possessed against his will (not that Jensen would know or possibly worry about). It's just not on their radar. I probably have to accept that if I want to continue to enjoy the season (and series actually). I just have to accept that, much like last season, the reasons for why Sam is behaving in a certain way is not an issue - just that what he's doing is enough to create a reaction from Dean. And now that the story is moving to the Mark (and Dean changing because of it), there will be even less focus on Dean feeling/learning/growing from anything he's done. In fact, Sam's attitude is likely to be driving him toward that darkness. Sam will just have to move on (*fandom cheers*) and forget that the first part of the season even happened for him. I could be wrong and they may well integrate Sam's past experiences into his story arc, but I can't see it. Though I suspect we'll be watching Sam fight for his brother - which will be cool too. At this point it's the only thing I can imagine happening that will calm down all the hate.
It's so wonderful that Jensen gave up his time to give this interview. It's a shame that it will (already has) created even more of the Sam v Dean crap. I ranted on tumblr about all that so I won't repeat it here. Needless to say I am totally over it and I think I might be joining fellow fans and remaining off fandom sites until the storyline allows people to actually behave civilly.
That said, I am more than happy to discuss the interview as long there's no nastiness - for either Sam, Dean or Jensen.
Jensen's kindly given an interview to The Winchester Brothers on Winchester Radio recently (I suggest you avoid the comments in the above link if you want to avoid some nastiness. I accidentally saw some and decided to respond. I KNOW I shouldn't have done but dammit I was steaming). I actually read a transcript of the interview (and I've just seen that
stir_of_echoes has created one also <3) rather than listen to it. I started to listen but found it a little…er…messy (which might have been because of nerves maybe).I think
missyjack said it best when she called Jensen the ultimate Dean!girl. :) And so he should be. Listening to him talk about Dean is wonderful and insightful. I love how supportive he is of the character and it has given me some insights to how he goes about playing him. I particularly love how he includes his experiences in Purgatory as something that drives Dean. We never see that (unfortunately!), but it's wonderful that Jensen's using it for inspiration. It's also interesting to hear his take on Sam. Some of it I found hard to accept and I didn't agree with quite a bit of it, but I did find it interesting. I know that Jensen probably doesn't spent a lot of time analysing Sam's character (if at all), so it's not surprising that his comments are based on Dean's experience of Sam and not how he sees Sam fitting into the overall picture. Which makes sense because as an actor you are totally focused on your own character (I'm hoping Jared will do a similar interview because I'd love to hear his insights into Sam).
I wasn't totally thrilled by the pitch of some of the questions (in fact, it was a little disappointing that the interviewers weren't more objective and even handed with the questions) but there were some great questions that allowed Jensen to really talk about his character.
Some interesting comments he made:
Obviously, Dean is willing to go all-in and keep the family together, and keep the brothers moving down the road and it seems that more and more, Sam is willing to cash out and he’s not willing to put his life on the line the way that Dean is.
Not going to deny that this comment really took me aback. I have no idea what "cash out" means but if this is the Sam we are going to be seeing in the future it might well be the final straw for me. I'm not quite sure what Jensen's take on 8.23 was but Sam was completely ready to put his life on the line for the greater good. And er….end S5? Though I will accept that Jensen might be channeling Dean and thinks that Sam won't lay his life on the line for Dean. Which is crazy of course, but it's something Dean would absolutely be feeling (though if Show decides that actually Sam WON'T lay his life on the line for Dean then it's not the show I originally started watching so it'll be all over red rover for me).
That’s a tough pill for Dean to swallow, and I think the only way he’s dealing with it is by not dealing with it.
That's a really interesting observation and I think that's definitely true. I love that he mentioned this because I've wondered if Dean not acknowledging what Sam has suffered is part of him just not wanting to deal. We've seen Dean shut down more and more I think.
The mark of Cain has given him a simplicity in his thoughts that’s allowing him to ignore the complexity of their relationship right now and focus on the prize, which is Abbadon at this point
Fair call..but…um….Abbadon is the prize? I thought Gadreel was on the top of Dean's list? Not sure exactly how Addadon became top priority. Maybe it's because it's what Crowley wants? I'm trying to remember why Addadon is such a thorn in Dean's side - considering she hasn't really featured much this season (or last for that matter). Curious.
So, I think the line between black and white is becoming almost dangerously clear, the grey areas are becoming less and less as far as Dean is concerned.
Awesome! The Mark is going to be really interesting for Dean. Seeing a cold (almost soulless) Dean is going to give Jensen some great stuff to work with and will be great to watch.
Yeah, for a long time there were a lot of different storylines going on, mostly revolving around Sam, and what the story was doing to Sam although a lot of it, it could be said was being seen through Dean’s perspective, the story was always, kind of about Sam and what was going on internally with him
Pretty much what we all know and have said for a while. Though not sure how "what was going on internally with him" means as we don't get a lot on what's going on with him internally. I mean, we get the angst but we don't get to see the result of all the crap that happens to him. But I get it - from Dean's perspective stuff is ALWAYS happening to Sam (and my god it really is!) and I kinda get the sense that Jensen is happy for the "stuff" is now going to be happening to him.
Which I'm pretty darn excited by too. He also talks about the roles reversing - which makes me wonder if we'll get to watch Dean's story through Sam's eyes now? I think that would be pretty cool if handled right.
Yeah, Sam’s a real selfish asshole is what it boils down to (laughs)
It is true, Sam seems to be a little preoccupied and maybe it’s a little brother thing. Maybe he’s
“You’re my big brother you can figure it out yourself.”
But that’s a contrast to the way Dean thinks as in, “I’m the big brother and I have to protect my little brother from harm.” That’s kind of been his creed for as long as he can remember so I think that they both kind of come at it from different angles. Sam is more willing to allow for things to happen as they happen and it’s a Sam-centric world in his mind, and I think it always has been and I think it’s been a Sam-centric show for a long time
Yeah. I probably should just let this go. I know Jensen said some of this in jest but if even Jensen thinks Sam's an asshole what the hell hope do any of us have that think he's not. *sigh* And Sam is Sam-centric? Yeah, saving the world was all about Sam. Trying to trade himself for Dean in hell was clearly all about Sam. Sam continuing to hunt, save people, listen and help people is only because Sam thinks about himself. Clearly. (I know I am coming across as some sort of bitter Sam!girl, but I seriously must be watching a different show if, after everything, Sam is still considered selfish). I am aware that Jensen is talking about the characters and it makes sense that that is what Dean would be thinking - but even then Dean KNOWS Sam is not selfish - he's seen first hand the things Sam has been willing to do for others. I suppose it's fair that Jensen might think that though - considering a lot of fandom thinks the same.
What does come across clearly is Jensen wanting something more for his character. And I don't blame him. When we look back and think about everything that has happened to Sam it's pretty epic. Jared has been able to play all sorts of characters - many different versions of Sam. Jensen hasn't really had that opportunity, so I think Jensen has a right to be feeling pretty over Jared getting all the cool stuff. Jensen plays "dark" very well (end!verse Dean is still one of my fav Deans) and I think the Mark is going to give him some great material to work with. Oooh, we still might get to see 2014!Dean emerge. That would be wicked if they somehow gave us that future version of Dean - what a cool tie in.
Whether he protects him because of the fear of loneliness, whatever the reason is, I don’t think Dean sits in his bed and psychoanalyses himself all that much.
Definitely. And interestingly it's coming across exactly like that. WE do! But Dean doesn't. Even non-Mark Dean wouldn't contemplate his motivations too much. He just is.
Winchester Radio: To that end, are there any decisions that Dean has made over the years that you could revisit and possibly alter in some way?
What would be the issue if you were to do so?
Jensen: Not invite Gadreel into Sam. That would be number one on the list.
*phew* I'm glad we're on the same page about that. And he, like me, understands that what Dean did is all part of the story telling. This isn't Jensen saying he didn't what that for Dean, but rather knowing that Dean would want do-over on that one decision.
I have to say this interview hasn't given me a lot of hope for the storyline exploring Sam being possessed against his will (not that Jensen would know or possibly worry about). It's just not on their radar. I probably have to accept that if I want to continue to enjoy the season (and series actually). I just have to accept that, much like last season, the reasons for why Sam is behaving in a certain way is not an issue - just that what he's doing is enough to create a reaction from Dean. And now that the story is moving to the Mark (and Dean changing because of it), there will be even less focus on Dean feeling/learning/growing from anything he's done. In fact, Sam's attitude is likely to be driving him toward that darkness. Sam will just have to move on (*fandom cheers*) and forget that the first part of the season even happened for him. I could be wrong and they may well integrate Sam's past experiences into his story arc, but I can't see it. Though I suspect we'll be watching Sam fight for his brother - which will be cool too. At this point it's the only thing I can imagine happening that will calm down all the hate.
It's so wonderful that Jensen gave up his time to give this interview. It's a shame that it will (already has) created even more of the Sam v Dean crap. I ranted on tumblr about all that so I won't repeat it here. Needless to say I am totally over it and I think I might be joining fellow fans and remaining off fandom sites until the storyline allows people to actually behave civilly.
That said, I am more than happy to discuss the interview as long there's no nastiness - for either Sam, Dean or Jensen.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
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Date: 2014-03-12 12:41 pm (UTC)Jensen has been nothing but pro-SPN and he felt comfortable enough to talk candidly about the Dean char and most of his answers were Dean's POV. There was probably some Jensen bleed in there, but honestly...it always has been the Sam show.
If you were an actor wouldn't you get sick of always being the support rather than the main story?
They brought this awesome MOC story in and then didn't really touch on it again. Instead they have Jensen go with a nuanced portrayal of an increasingly angry, emotionless Dean.
I love that Jensen actually have us a little insight into the season but didn't really give us any details. I know I'll be paying attention the next few eps especially.
And the interview itself was very one sided. I'm sure the WB peeps were just nervous but man...no interaction. "That's interesting" is not a good way to get into a good dialogue. Especially when Jensen was so open and friendly.
I really hope Ayisha Tyler gets him on Girl on Guy. She gives good interview. I love both of Jared's w her.
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Date: 2014-03-12 01:24 pm (UTC)I admit to having a personal interest in Sam's story so all I am doing here is trying to work out what might be in store for that part of the story line. It's also my way of bracing for things that might be to come. I've been having an extremely hard time with all the Sam hate so it's nice (for me) to have a place I can discuss stuff like this in a safe-(ish) place . I can't deny that some of the things that were said hit close for me, but that's just because I feel for a lot for Sam.
I love that Jensen actually have us a little insight into the season but didn't really give us any details. I know I'll be paying attention the next few eps especially.
Oh me too!!
And I would LOVE Ayisha Tyler to get Jensen on. Her interviews with Jared were fabulous. :))
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Date: 2014-03-12 07:42 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-03-12 10:46 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-03-13 04:19 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-03-13 01:56 am (UTC)The stupid app didn't give the full run down of your comments on the interview. It only gave the very top part of it. So now, of course that I'm home, I can see all your other viewpoints.
I keep seeing a lot of Jensen hate on Tumblr about this interview. He's a little more gruff than Jared's happy puppy in interviews. I think he's a bit more serious from what I can gather. But I think Jensen seems like he'd give a much better interview if there was some interaction. When the WB girls finally joked a little bit with him, things got a little more even.
I'm a Dean girl. This is a shocker of course. LOL I really love the MOC storyline and the dark and dangerous side of Dean coming out to play. It's giving Jensen something to sink his teeth into. As an actor it's gotta get old to do the same kind of thing again and again.
And I love Sam. I'm definitely not on the Sam hate train that's in the overstuffed capacity these days. But I do think that Jensen takes himself out of the Dean questions. He knows this character inside and out and his answers are very Dean.
To Dean, Sam is being an asshole. Doesn't make him love him any less. One of Dean's greatest flaws is his quick to judge and slow to change aspect to his personality. And I totally understand that Sam wants to shake him stupid.
I'm very nervous about the future of our show. And yet, I'm cautiously optimistic that we'll get a strong storyline that allows both of our boys to find an even ground again. There's a lot of hurt between them and they both have to find a way to compromise to find that center again.
The MOC is obviously going to screw this all up. And THAT part makes good drama. The sniping and stubbornness on both sides--that's an inherent part of the boys.
I hope to Chuck the writers know what they're doing by making Sam say such blatantly hurtful words to Dean. It polarized the fandom. Now...does that make buzz? Make people talk about SPN? Yes. Actually it did.
But let's not alienate the fandom that has kept this show on the map. That's what has me worried. Our show has been amazing for years because the writers always dug deep to find interesting stories. Even with the unevenness of S6 & 7 there were still gems in there.
I hope to hell that Carver is smart and keeps the writers in check. This 'tearing down to build them up' sounds good in theory, but the execution has been tough to take. And the filler episodes have been way too numerous this season.
The back 8 eps need to focus on the main storyline and the brothers actually talking to each other, not AT each other.
As for the Abaddon thing--Personally, I think that might be a little of the MOC talking. I know Dean was focused on killing Abaddon earlier, before the mark, but I think that was just because he needed to focus on something he could do. Now the mark has him on a laser focus.
If the jawbone can kill Abaddon...just what would it do to an angel? Anything at all?
Anyway, I just wanted to come on and apologize if I sounded harsh earlier. The Jensen hate was really getting me crazy. We so rarely get Jensen to do an interview and all the backlash (not yours) makes me nervy that he'll back off and not give interviews again.
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Date: 2014-03-13 12:15 pm (UTC)I did worry that my tone suggested that I was hating on Jensen - which would be totally hypocritical considering I've been lamenting the Sam hate lately.
I enjoy discussing this stuff and it's my hope that it's a considered discussion, rather than a hate flinging one. I'm very fortunate to have amazing fans on my flist who are discuss thoughtfully - whether they be Sam, Dean, or bi-bro fans. :)
I keep seeing a lot of Jensen hate on Tumblr about this interview.
I'm really sorry to hear that. I haven't gone looking so I didn't know what the reaction may have been - I've kept my dash clear of anyone who posts fanwank. I know that he said some stuff that has ignited the Sam!hate and it's unfortunate that fans feel like they have to say horrid things in order to make themselves feel important.
I really love the MOC storyline and the dark and dangerous side of Dean coming out to play.
Oh me too. I'm really looking forward to it. I've been wanting jensen to do soothing that he feels passionate about. I think sometimes his, um, disinterest in what they are making Dean do comes through. To be one of Jensen's finest performances was in the The End. You could tell how much he was loving what he was doing.
To Dean, Sam is being an asshole. Doesn't make him love him any less.
Yes. And ditto for Sam. Even though Sam said some hurtful things he still loves Dean deeply. I think much of the story is about learning to see each other through different eyes. Dean needs to understand why Sam is so hurt and pissed (which, still puzzles me because in 9.01 Dean knew what he was doing was going to piss off Sam. I keep thinking that he probably thought Sam would never find out and all would be good), and Sam needs to appreciate where Dean is coming from when he makes these choices. He needs to see why he can't live without Sam and why making those choices is crucial to who he is. It's a two way street - which is why I get so upset by the wanky hate flying around.
I hope to Chuck the writers know what they're doing by making Sam say such blatantly hurtful words to Dean.
Yeah. It's so curious to me because the words WERE hurtful but because I desperately wanted Sam to not let what Dean did slide I was cheering him on. Of course it wasn't until after the episode and the subsequent vilification of Sam did I realise that Sam just can't get away with hurting Dean that way (in the fandom). I'm not sure if you follow my journal, but I wrote some thoughts on that a few weeks ago. On paper, Sam should be the one getting the sympathy vote, but he just doesn't command that level of sympathy from many fans. Personally, I think Sam did the right thing by speaking up - losing his autonomy over and over has to have an effect oh him. I think it's just a shame they made him say stuff that went against the brotherhood and therefore everything we hold dear about the show.
But let's not alienate the fandom that has kept this show on the map.
OMG this. There are so many annoyed fans and it's like they've lost their respect for us by creating such a horrid divide between the boys. I can only hope it's because they have something incredible up their sleeves in the future. I do worry though.
I know Dean was focused on killing Abaddon earlier, before the mark, but I think that was just because he needed to focus on something he could do.
Yes. And maybe dealing with Gadreel is too close to what's going on with Sam. Maybe even mentioning Gadreel is too much for him. Abaddon could be where he diverts his frustration.
Anyway, I just wanted to come on and apologize if I sounded harsh earlier.
Thanks. I appreciate you coming back. :) I hope the backlash doesn't put Jensen off doing interviews. I figure Jared will be copping quite a bit too - considering he's an easier target being on Twitter. Hopefully they have the sense to avoid it all.
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Date: 2014-03-13 02:26 pm (UTC)I think one measure of "sympathetic" here is espousing what are seen as the show's values (I think it's often a misinterpretation of those values, if by that we mean s1-5 core themes -- to me, Kripke era was pretty clear that Mary's, John's, and Dean's deals were Not Good Things, that Sam buying into Winchester models of revenge quest and turning Johnlike in s4 was moral self-destruction, and however sentimental the "they chose family" tag was, the saves of 5.18 and 5.22 were premised on Sam and Dean each trusting and respecting the other's capacity for making decisions based on what was good for the world). In that respect, I think they need to stick to their guns with "unsympathetic" Sam, at least insofar as that means having a voice that doesn't buy into the "grand gesture" ideal.
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Date: 2014-03-13 02:42 pm (UTC)Would they be this brave? Be this thoughtful about Sam and the message that maybe choosing family isn't always a good thing? Would Carver survive fandom if he makes a point that everything that Mary, John and Dean have done in the name of family isn't positive or healthy or right? Me thinks not. But boy I'd be impressed if he took that on. If he actually took on the very foundation that this show is built on and found a way to actually put a stop to the Winchester desire to sacrifice and make ill fated deals that would be quite epic.
Damn you for giving me such hope! (hee…not really of course, but I dread it not being so clever…)
xx
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Date: 2014-03-13 03:03 pm (UTC)But, really, the cynical bottom line is that Carver doesn't have to survive fandom. His ratings are fine (by the CW standards, excellent), so he can pretty much do what he wants. I think most of what hampers him is that he's honestly not all that great at excitingly imagining out his vision in large story arc form, and then for the individual episodes his writing bench is weak. Whether or not I end up agreeing with the ideas behind what he does, I don't think I'll love its execution. But I guess I do have a certain fundamental respect for him, in that I do think the ideas behind what he does are his honest ideas and I don't think he's out to do whatever will make him most popular (in the fandom arena: however helpful ratings are for keeping one's salary check coming, I think it's probably still bruising to the ego to have a statistically insignificant but very vocal audience hating what you're doing). Of course, it's possible that I'm wrong and he's just very, very bad at courting popularity.
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Date: 2014-03-13 03:28 pm (UTC)The fact that the ratings are so good suggest that he's doing something right. And tbh I'd hope that popularity isn't something he pursues, especially if he has an overall vision (I can't imagine he does with the constant brother conflict). I'd rather he stick to his plans and not adjust things to "please" fandom (impossible anyway). But I agree the execution is likely to be messy and the road is going to be bloody bumpy.
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Date: 2014-03-12 07:44 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-03-13 01:57 am (UTC)I understand they only got an hour and wanted to make the most of it, but a dialogue between them would have been so much more interesting!
*headdesk* Made me nuts!
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Date: 2014-03-13 08:29 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-03-14 02:17 pm (UTC)And, yeah, I don't get why the Sam fans don't understand -- it's not about screen time, it's about stretching his acting muscles. I bet Jensen could do most of Dean in his sleep by now. Jared has had his acting muscles stretched a lot playing different versions of himself -- I'm sure Jensen also wants an acting challenge so it is more interesting for him professionally. He's such a fine actor -- and he probably wants to work on his range. There was a lot of that in the beginning for him -- Season 2, season 3, etc. but less now. 9 years with the same character, he wants to explore different aspects of that character.
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Date: 2014-03-14 06:18 pm (UTC)Jensen: Dean tends to stay Dean no matter where he is or what situation he's in -- he's just angry. Back in "The French Mistake," the one and only time we've been brought into a conceptualized meeting, they wanted to know how we felt about using ourselves. I said "as long as Dean never deviates from Dean, you can put us anywhere you want." Jared deals with that with Sam a lot more, the altering of the character, he does a really good job of it. I'm kind of fortunate that I stay the course.
Jensen may have been being political, or he may have changed his mind, but as of July, Jensen was saying he isn't that interested in stretching his muscles by playing characters that weren't Dean.
no subject
Date: 2014-03-14 09:58 pm (UTC)After that, a fan asked about Jensen's opinion on Dean's storyline--or rather his lack of one. I was rather surprised when he not only agreed with her that there were problems with Dean's storyline but also by how open and passionate about it he was. I was expecting a much more toned down response, but I have to say I'm both pleased and saddened by his frustration with where the writers/showrunners have taken his character, and by his willingness to express that to us.
Jensen talked at length about his frustration with being constantly 'teased' by the story--starting Dean down a path and then pulling back, over and over. He said very plainly that he wants Dean to go somewhere--"just give me something to work with, I'll take him there!" He mentioned that for the first time, he had both called and emailed Jeremy Carver about Dean and the issues he's been having with Dean's story always being dropped, and that he had set up a meeting for himself and Jared with Jeremy and the writers. He also emphasized that screentime is not the same as having a story, and used the example of this season being very much about what's happening with Sam, yet Jared has had 23 days off already this season while Jensen is still in single digits. What he wants is a story that actually goes somewhere and doesn't get dropped or turned into something else.
I think most Dean fans would agree with this 1000%.
no subject
Date: 2014-03-15 02:03 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-03-15 02:43 am (UTC)The quote itself refers to Season 6. Jensen was talking about past history. He's also often made comments that when he gets lines that don't read true to Dean he's called the writers to discuss them and change them. This is a bit redolent of that.
However, the fact that this time he wrote and emailed and brought Jared to the meeting -- IOW, thoroughly reinforced his position every way he could -- certainly suggests to me that he may well have mentioned these things before with less backup. And not really gotten through to the writers or the show runner in any sustained manner.
Also, I blame nothing on the Sam fans about the state of Dean's lack of arc except not understanding why Jensen would obviously want an arc in the first place and being unsympathetic to that idea. The lack of arc has, IMO, been a real loss to the show these last few years. It's definitely made it less interesting to me.