(no subject)

[ash48]

I am considering (considering) opening a topic for discussion on whether destiel will become canon in the show sometime soon.

What do you think?

[Poll #1913053]

Comments

[tiniowien.livejournal.com]

I love you to bits and your posts always make me smile but the choices you put up there for that poll hit me as really quite peculiar. I can see how you went from yes to no to yes again in theory, but as I went down the list I found it harder to try and pick one to click and answer. It kind of unsettled me and I can't put my finger on why, so I'm going to give an apology hug for the ramble and head back to my corner after this. <3

The fact that you're even considering braving the waters of an essay on the topic however is really cool and I trust the reactions of folks here are more mature than on tumblr when any ship topic is brought up. Wank is never needed anywhere. :)

twisting_vine_x was very eloquent and I can't add much to her post, only to say that if Castiel's vessel had been originally chosen as female and their interactions across the years kept identical, critics would be lauding these two from the rooftop of every magazine as TV's most clever, unrequited build-up. The X-Files once made a fortune out of holding Mulder and Scully at arm's length while displaying their obvious care and affection for one another and then closing that gap ever so slowly over time.

I can't say personally if I ever see it becoming canon in the near future, but I know that whatever the show's endgame is/will be, they're certainly not above throwing constant titbits to the audience and I get the faint impression (from both online and my own friends and family - particularly my mother who is in her 60s and wouldn't understand subtle if it hit her with a proverbial brick) that these hints are broadening from the original nods to the side of the fandom they know is watching, to something casual viewers can -and have- picked up on. Whether this is part of a deliberate evolution or just them trying to please everyone while still making sure to add the bro moments I can't say. I know what I quietly have come to believe based on what I've witnessed and my own conversations with Misha, however they have two more seasons at least and if I were a gambling woman I'd say we wouldn't get anything concrete (if we ever do) until the final days.

[percysowner.livejournal.com]

Sadly, if Cas's vessel had been female from the beginning I doubt the character would have remained on the show. Virtually any female character who was of an age to be a love interest and who had a long term role has been disliked by fandom. AFAIK Cas was originally supposed to be on for a few episodes and then Anna would have taken on the role of angel who switches sides. The fandom fell in love with Misha so he stayed and Anna went.

[tiniowien.livejournal.com]

Perhaps I should have prefaced my sentence with 'hypothetically' as yes, the show does enjoy killing it's ladies and I agree completely that Cas as a woman would have been bumped off before the fourth season even came to a close. I simply meant to show their interactions in a different light.

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Hey there hun!

I am sorry some of my poll options let you feeling unsettled. It was a little tricky because I was trying to go for a mix of light hearted and trying to think of the different ways everyone might respond. ;))

And no hiding in corners. Thanks for coming out to share. I appreciate it.

I really like what you've said here and actually, it makes the most sense I've read in terms of Dean and Cas ever becoming canon. I honestly could never see it, but looking at it like Mulder and Scully I am seeing that they might go there. If they've decided that they are going to keep playing the sexual tension card then I'd say that..yes. we might see the final episode as Dean and Cas declaring their romantic love for each other. Hmmmm...even though I don't ship D/C I can see how this could possibly turn around.

Would I want it? Aside from it being a pretty amazing step for the show to take, my happily ever after for the show is Sam and Dean riding off into the sunset together, so no it's not a direction I'd like to see the show to take. But wow...you've made good case. And as long as Sam isn't sidelined I might even turn around on the idea one day...;)

xox

[tiniowien.livejournal.com]

I wanted to first of all hug the stuffing out of you and I came back with that intention... and holy heck, woman! Over a hundred comments on this post! That's amazing!

The only thing I've been prompted to add seeing your very sweet reply is that I realised something just the other week (and it's funny how it took me so long to come to this conclusion; I guess you don't notice things until they smack you in the face). And I guess you could put this down to my solid introduction to this fandom being Wincest -but I know a ton of others who hold D/C as their OTP to end all, yadda yadda who also feel the same- but I have a preference in my reading of fics and you reminded me of it with your final lines. If I'm reading a D/C fic, then it only rings completely true to me if despite the pairing, Sam is the entire utter focus and soul of Dean's world. He's the floppy-haired, freakishly-huge, ever-smiling dead center of Dean's wildly spinning universe and Dean couldn't possibly be prouder of him or adore him more. Anything less than that and I close the page.

And I honestly believe this is something the show will honour until it's final gasp; because whether Dean and Sam get the well deserved reward of being able to ride off into the sunset or they go down swinging and end up finding their peace in heaven, there's nowhere they would close the series out that wouldn't have them together. And so many D/C fans understand, embrace and enjoy this fact; should anything become canon between Dean and Cas, I strongly believe it wouldn't take away from that. It would simply be something that's present in it's own quiet way, not a 'pick sides and see who you end up with... but you can only pick one!' situation.

Because the sane, rational multitudes (we don't count the crazies or the haters here) who peer at Dean and Cas with curious expectation, love Sam with as much fire and devotion as his big bro does. He should never be sidelined. :)

Shutting up now. :P

[ash48.livejournal.com]

Hey!

I have to say that comment filled my heart with warm fuzzies. :D You probably know I'm a die hard Sam!gal (who adores Dean), so I always think the D/C stuff is about shutting Sam out. I mean, I've never read any so I have no idea hwo Sam in portrayed in those fics, but I always think it's going to be like on the show in the eps that Dean and Cas are heavily featured - and that's with Sam going off and doing his own thing and not being part of their story. But I am sure they are not all like that (as you've confirmed).

It's the same with how I feel about them ending the series. If they do decide to make D/C canon I would be desperate to know how Sam features in the scenario, because everything we know about Dean is that Sam is pretty much his whole world. I think it's possible that Sam can still be Dean's world even when he's in love with someone (though so far that has to be proved...;D).

I haven't dipped my toe in the D/C world at all so it's actually really nice to know that there is some parts of it where Sam isn't an annoying little brother that Dean forgets about because he has Cas.

(and if there was a story that has D/C with lots of Sam I might actually give it a go...*g*)

Thanks hun! Oh and yes - I have been blown away by how many comments there are and all have them have been so civil (even when holding different views...)

xxx

[tiniowien.livejournal.com]

*squish*

It's a very, very common misconception that Destiel fans wish for Sam to disappear. I have no idea who started it or who continues it to this day (trolls mostly, I'm guessing), but if you talk to fans that's almost never the case. Nearly every D/C fic I have ever read -excluding the pure PWP in some cases- has Sam in the story to a very decent capacity and in every fic -barring some highly disturbing AUs that I've had the displeasure of coming across- Sam and Dean's relationship is identical to that on the show. We talk about how much we adore Sam in posts, meta and picspams outside of fic as well - and an ideal world for a lot of people is Team Free Will with no one forgotten. So much love. :)

Your open mind is your best trait. Never lose it. And now I'm putting this poor thread to bed. *g*